Thread for basic questions

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Hunting
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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by Hunting » March 31st, 2020, 10:45 am

dvgrn wrote:
March 31st, 2020, 10:38 am
HartmutHolzwart wrote:
March 31st, 2020, 1:39 am
Matthias Merzenich maintains jslife-moving-master as an update to jslife. There is a c5d folder there! Check out on Github, newest version from Jan, 22nd., 2020.
I did mention the jslife-moving collection, but should have added an actual link to the relevant folder. I was looking at an out-of-date local copy; an old p1585 rake was added since I downloaded it, but not surprisingly it's not anything you could call "small" either.
Then say congratulations to Naszvadi, he discovered the smallest c/5d puffer:
Naszvadi wrote:
March 27th, 2020, 5:53 am
AFAIK there'd been constructed several c/5d puffers already, but here is a compact one from scratch using only 3 ships and a glider:

Code: Select all

x = 63, y = 63, rule = B3/S23
55bo5bo$54bo7bo$57b4obo$53bo2bo3b2o$53bo2bo2b3o$53bo4bo$54bob3o$54b2ob
2o$50b3o4b2o$50b3o$48b2o$48b2o$48b2o$43b3o$41bo4b2o$40bo6bo$43b2obo$
42bo3b3o$42bo2b4o$42bobo$42b3o$40bo2b2o$41b2o12$49bo5bo$48bo7bo$51b4ob
o$47bo2bo3b2o$47bo2bo2b3o$47bo4bo$15bo5bo26bob3o$14bo7bo25b2ob2o$17b4o
bo21b3o4b2o$13bo2bo3b2o9bo12b3o$13bo2bo2b3o7bobo10b2o$13bo4bo11b2o10b
2o$14bob3o23b2o$14b2ob2o18b3o$10b3o4b2o16bo4b2o$10b3o21bo6bo$8b2o27b2o
bo$8b2o26bo3b3o$8b2o26bo2b4o$3b3o30bobo$bo4b2o28b3o$o6bo26bo2b2o$3b2ob
o28b2o$2bo3b3o$2bo2b4o$2bobo$2b3o$o2b2o$b2o!
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calcyman
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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by calcyman » April 3rd, 2020, 1:58 pm

Hunting wrote:
March 31st, 2020, 10:45 am
Then say congratulations to Naszvadi, he discovered the smallest c/5d puffer:
Naszvadi wrote:
March 27th, 2020, 5:53 am
AFAIK there'd been constructed several c/5d puffers already, but here is a compact one from scratch using only 3 ships and a glider:

Code: Select all

x = 63, y = 63, rule = B3/S23
55bo5bo$54bo7bo$57b4obo$53bo2bo3b2o$53bo2bo2b3o$53bo4bo$54bob3o$54b2ob
2o$50b3o4b2o$50b3o$48b2o$48b2o$48b2o$43b3o$41bo4b2o$40bo6bo$43b2obo$
42bo3b3o$42bo2b4o$42bobo$42b3o$40bo2b2o$41b2o12$49bo5bo$48bo7bo$51b4ob
o$47bo2bo3b2o$47bo2bo2b3o$47bo4bo$15bo5bo26bob3o$14bo7bo25b2ob2o$17b4o
bo21b3o4b2o$13bo2bo3b2o9bo12b3o$13bo2bo2b3o7bobo10b2o$13bo4bo11b2o10b
2o$14bob3o23b2o$14b2ob2o18b3o$10b3o4b2o16bo4b2o$10b3o21bo6bo$8b2o27b2o
bo$8b2o26bo3b3o$8b2o26bo2b4o$3b3o30bobo$bo4b2o28b3o$o6bo26bo2b2o$3b2ob
o28b2o$2bo3b3o$2bo2b4o$2bobo$2b3o$o2b2o$b2o!
Congratulations! I've added it to the LifeWiki: https://conwaylife.com/wiki/C/5_diagonal#Puffers
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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by JP21 » April 3rd, 2020, 10:53 pm

I already saw that post with the smallest c/5d puffer but I kept my mouth shut...

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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by gameoflifemaniac » April 6th, 2020, 1:27 pm

How to find the number of different 3-glider collisions?
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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by dvgrn » April 6th, 2020, 4:19 pm

gameoflifemaniac wrote:
April 6th, 2020, 1:27 pm
How to find the number of different 3-glider collisions?
Rough answer: count the number of lines of data in rles.txt or colseqs.txt. Answer: 464,745.

Not-so-rough answer: go through those collisions and remove any duplicates you find (there do seem to be a few) and maybe find any that are missing. That 464,745 number has definitely not been verified, and if other people tried to independently repeat 2718281828's work, they would no doubt come up with slightly different total numbers.

To get a precise answer, first you'll have to define exactly what a "three-glider collision" means. There are a very large number of cases where, e.g., a glider gets kicked back into a long-running 2G reaction like two-glider mess, or a glider from the two-glider mess collides with another glider to make another two-glider mess that interacts with the first two-glider mess.

For example, keep moving the northernmost glider in the pattern below northwards in steps of two, and decide exactly when the resulting three-glider collision stops counting as a new three-glider collision, and starts being just "more of the same". Unless you decide that, there isn't really a well-defined answer to the question, because we can trivially get an unbounded number of distinct big messy boring constellations just by moving that one glider farther north:

Code: Select all

x = 86, y = 105, rule = B3/S23
bo$2bo$3o91$84bo$83bo$83b3o7$81bo$80b2o$80bobo!
It seems to be that this reaction at least should really count as a unique collision (just not a particularly interesting one). But I don't think it's included in 2718281828's lists, because it can't be found using the synthesise-patt script. So probably hundreds of thousands of other useless huge messy constellations are also excluded from the 464,745 number.

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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by gameoflifemaniac » April 6th, 2020, 4:36 pm

dvgrn wrote:
April 6th, 2020, 4:19 pm
gameoflifemaniac wrote:
April 6th, 2020, 1:27 pm
How to find the number of different 3-glider collisions?
Rough answer: count the number of lines of data in rles.txt or colseqs.txt. Answer: 464,745.

Not-so-rough answer: go through those collisions and remove any duplicates you find (there do seem to be a few) and maybe find any that are missing. That 464,745 number has definitely not been verified, and if other people tried to independently repeat 2718281828's work, they would no doubt come up with slightly different total numbers.

To get a precise answer, first you'll have to define exactly what a "three-glider collision" means. There are a very large number of cases where, e.g., a glider gets kicked back into a long-running 2G reaction like two-glider mess, or a glider from the two-glider mess collides with another glider to make another two-glider mess that interacts with the first two-glider mess.

For example, keep moving the northernmost glider in the pattern below northwards in steps of two, and decide exactly when the resulting three-glider collision stops counting as a new three-glider collision, and starts being just "more of the same". Unless you decide that, there isn't really a well-defined answer to the question, because we can trivially get an unbounded number of distinct big messy boring constellations just by moving that one glider farther north:

Code: Select all

x = 86, y = 105, rule = B3/S23
bo$2bo$3o91$84bo$83bo$83b3o7$81bo$80b2o$80bobo!
It seems to be that this reaction at least should really count as a unique collision (just not a particularly interesting one). But I don't think it's included in 2718281828's lists, because it can't be found using the synthesise-patt script. So probably hundreds of thousands of other useless huge messy constellations are also excluded from the 464,745 number.
Sorry, I thought this was left unsolved.
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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by Hunting » April 10th, 2020, 12:43 am

EDIT: Destroyed the original post.

How to use dr? Where did the input file come from? The input must contain a pattern, but how did you generate that pattern?
MLP will live on forever, so does John Horton Conway.
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“Quick, hide it!”
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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by bubblegum » April 24th, 2020, 11:34 pm

how do i use python with golly? i think i'm doing something right because it's crashing, not throwing up an error message when i put in the path to the file (python27.dll in the python section of the scripts folder)
b3-nqrs23 (ribbons)

Code: Select all

x = 29, y = 16, rule = B3-nqr/S23
3b3o$3bo2bo$5b2o3$2o16b2o4bob2o$obo15bobo3b2o2bo$2bobo14b2o6b2o$3b2o17b
2ob2o$6bob2o13bobo2bo$5b2obo8b2obo5b3o$4bo3bobo6b2ob2o$3obobo2b2o12b2o
2b2o$5b2o9b2o4b2obobo$16b2o7bobo$25b2o!

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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by wildmyron » April 25th, 2020, 4:02 am

bubblegum wrote:
April 24th, 2020, 11:34 pm
how do i use python with golly? i think i'm doing something right because it's crashing, not throwing up an error message when i put in the path to the file (python27.dll in the python section of the scripts folder)
You don't need a python27.dll file in your Scripts/Python folder - and it's best not to have one there or to copy it to any other place at all.

Please read this post for a potential cause of your crash and hopefully the solution.
The latest version of the 5S Project contains over 226,000 spaceships. There is also a GitHub mirror of the collection. Tabulated pages up to period 160 (out of date) are available on the LifeWiki.

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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by yujh » April 26th, 2020, 8:27 am

Any search program for sparklers or grey ships?
B34kz5e7c8/S23-a4ityz5k!!!
Mission: find a rule with 2-5ob,7-15d,3-5o ships and 4 sparky hp osc.
B2ikn35j6i/S23-a8
B2ck3ar4ac5e6c7/S1e2-an3ejnr4air5iy6c7c8

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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by dvgrn » April 26th, 2020, 8:42 am

yujh wrote:
April 26th, 2020, 8:27 am
Any search program for sparklers or grey ships?
Sparkers -- start with JLS, it's fairly easy to get it set up, though it takes some practice to understand how to set up a search.

Grayships are more of an art than a science; I think people use JLS/WLS/lifesrch also to find the various pieces of grayships and put them together, but there's no simple walkthrough to explain how that's done.

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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by yujh » April 26th, 2020, 8:50 am

dvgrn wrote:
April 26th, 2020, 8:42 am
yujh wrote:
April 26th, 2020, 8:27 am
Any search program for sparklers or grey ships?
Sparkers -- start with JLS, it's fairly easy to get it set up, though it takes some practice to understand how to set up a search.

Grayships are more of an art than a science; I think people use JLS/WLS/lifesrch also to find the various pieces of grayships and put them together, but there's no simple walkthrough to explain how that's done.
Oh no is this Java?
I know nothing about it and where can I download it?
B34kz5e7c8/S23-a4ityz5k!!!
Mission: find a rule with 2-5ob,7-15d,3-5o ships and 4 sparky hp osc.
B2ikn35j6i/S23-a8
B2ck3ar4ac5e6c7/S1e2-an3ejnr4air5iy6c7c8

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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by Saka » April 26th, 2020, 9:30 am

yujh wrote:
April 26th, 2020, 8:50 am

Oh no is this Java?
I know nothing about it and where can I download it?
You don't actually need to code anything in Java, unless, of course, you want to modify it.
Download the Java Runtime Environment here:
https://www.java.com/en/download/

Code: Select all

o3b2ob2obo3b2o2b2o$bo3b2obob3o3bo2bo$2bo2b3o5b3ob4o$3o3bo2bo2b3o3b3o$
4bo4bobo4bo$2o2b2o2b4obo2bo3bo$2ob4o3bo2bo2bo2bo$b2o3bobob2o$3bobobo5b
obobobo$3bobobob2o3bo2bobo!
(Check gen 3)
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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by yujh » April 26th, 2020, 11:26 pm

How can I run it?(I use windows)
I don’t know how to use java.
472E72B0-88A0-4207-8A00-E01AEBD9087D.jpeg
472E72B0-88A0-4207-8A00-E01AEBD9087D.jpeg (14.38 KiB) Viewed 611 times
Meanwhile, is there other python based things?
B34kz5e7c8/S23-a4ityz5k!!!
Mission: find a rule with 2-5ob,7-15d,3-5o ships and 4 sparky hp osc.
B2ikn35j6i/S23-a8
B2ck3ar4ac5e6c7/S1e2-an3ejnr4air5iy6c7c8

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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by Saka » April 27th, 2020, 5:36 am

yujh wrote:
April 26th, 2020, 11:26 pm
How can I run it?(I use windows)
I don’t know how to use java.
[ymydzh]
Meanwhile, is there other python based things?
You should be able to just click on the .jar file once you've successfully installed the Java Runtime Environment. If Windows prompts an "Open With..." dialogue, select "Java(TM) SE Platform Binary" (I think that's what it's called).

Unfortunately there aren't any python-based search programs for spaceships/oscs/stuff like WLS, gfind, ntzfind, etc.

Code: Select all

o3b2ob2obo3b2o2b2o$bo3b2obob3o3bo2bo$2bo2b3o5b3ob4o$3o3bo2bo2b3o3b3o$
4bo4bobo4bo$2o2b2o2b4obo2bo3bo$2ob4o3bo2bo2bo2bo$b2o3bobob2o$3bobobo5b
obobobo$3bobobob2o3bo2bobo!
(Check gen 3)
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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by gameoflifemaniac » April 27th, 2020, 10:41 am

Are there any aperiodic spaceships in Life?
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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by wildmyron » April 27th, 2020, 1:02 pm

gameoflifemaniac wrote:
April 27th, 2020, 10:41 am
Are there any aperiodic spaceships in Life?
Can you give a definition of "aperiodic spaceships"? I can imagine a few theoretical constructs that merit that description, but no idea if they qualify.
The latest version of the 5S Project contains over 226,000 spaceships. There is also a GitHub mirror of the collection. Tabulated pages up to period 160 (out of date) are available on the LifeWiki.

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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by gameoflifemaniac » April 27th, 2020, 1:14 pm

wildmyron wrote:
April 27th, 2020, 1:02 pm
gameoflifemaniac wrote:
April 27th, 2020, 10:41 am
Are there any aperiodic spaceships in Life?
Can you give a definition of "aperiodic spaceships"? I can imagine a few theoretical constructs that merit that description, but no idea if they qualify.
An object that moves indefinitely but never actually repeats.
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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by Macbi » April 27th, 2020, 2:30 pm

We could presumably make an aperiodic spaceship using universal constructor technology. One of the odd things about it would be that it would necessarily grow as it travelled, because there are only finitely many different patterns in a given bounding box. So for example our universal constructor would have to keep a counter to keep track of which iteration it was on, and this counter would have to grow to store larger and larger numbers.

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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by wildmyron » April 27th, 2020, 9:26 pm

Growing spaceships are probably the simplest example.
The latest version of the 5S Project contains over 226,000 spaceships. There is also a GitHub mirror of the collection. Tabulated pages up to period 160 (out of date) are available on the LifeWiki.

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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by GUYTU6J » April 27th, 2020, 9:47 pm

Period-infinity (is it equivalent to aperiodic in some sense?) has been discussed before.
https://conwaylife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1730&f=2
The pattern in the rule "UnboundedCounter" has a non-totalistic example.

Code: Select all

x = 3, y = 2, rule = B2-a3ckq4ektwyz5-in6-i7e8/S1c3cijnr4ejrw5eq6ai
bo$obo!
Would it satisfy your question if the gun-like part moves?
EDIT: how about a "generally moving" total aperiodic pattern?
Lifewiki: User:GUYTU6J
---
Someone please find a use for this:

Code: Select all

x = 9, y = 7, rule = B3/S23
6bo$6bobo$5bo2bo$b2o3b2o$o2bo$bobo$2bo!
#C [[ COLOR BACKGROUND 255 200 82 COLOR ALIVE 81 143 51 ]]

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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by Hunting » April 27th, 2020, 11:36 pm

yujh wrote:
April 26th, 2020, 11:26 pm
Meanwhile, are there other python-based scripts?
Make one yourself!

EDIT: To make this post more worthwhile:

Why does LangtonsAnt_LUR resemble a bi-colored irregularly slow-downed Langton's Ant? It seems to produce several temporary oscillating engines that changes only the painted grids from green to purple and vice versa but how did that not affect the ant's trail?
Last edited by Hunting on April 27th, 2020, 11:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by yujh » April 27th, 2020, 11:42 pm

Hunting wrote:
April 27th, 2020, 11:36 pm
yujh wrote:
April 26th, 2020, 11:26 pm
Meanwhile, are there other python-based scripts?
Make one yourself!
Oh I'm bad at that( learned it mmyself for about weeks with no other help)
B34kz5e7c8/S23-a4ityz5k!!!
Mission: find a rule with 2-5ob,7-15d,3-5o ships and 4 sparky hp osc.
B2ikn35j6i/S23-a8
B2ck3ar4ac5e6c7/S1e2-an3ejnr4air5iy6c7c8

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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by gameoflifemaniac » April 30th, 2020, 2:38 pm

Will anyone try to further reduce the 23 cells required to make a quadratic growth pattern?
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Re: Thread for basic questions

Post by yujh » May 6th, 2020, 5:46 am

Is there a script for a pattern’s apgcode?
B34kz5e7c8/S23-a4ityz5k!!!
Mission: find a rule with 2-5ob,7-15d,3-5o ships and 4 sparky hp osc.
B2ikn35j6i/S23-a8
B2ck3ar4ac5e6c7/S1e2-an3ejnr4air5iy6c7c8

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