Page 48 of 53
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 5th, 2021, 4:22 pm
by MathAndCode
Jormungant wrote: ↑January 5th, 2021, 4:05 pm
edit : mmm, it seems I missed a fix previously posted, I guess there is a flood of posts here lately, now I need to check if there is more useful clearance here.
There were multiple stable versions previously posted. One has additional R and G outputs.
Edit: I wonder whether it's possible to extract this century.
Code: Select all
x = 13, y = 13, rule = LifeHistory
10.D$9.3D$11.2D7$3.C$2.2C$3C$C!
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 5th, 2021, 8:53 pm
by Extrementhusiast
Early dependent H-G:
Code: Select all
x = 22, y = 33, rule = LifeHistory
16.2A$16.2A$9.A$8.A.A$2A7.A$.A$.A.A$2.2A6$3.A.2A$.3A.2A$A$.3A.2A$3.A.
A$3.A.A$4.A4$17.2A$17.2A2$17.3D$18.C$17.ADCD$16.2A.2A$17.A2.A$17.A3.A
$17.A!
EDIT: HR22R:
Code: Select all
x = 12, y = 13, rule = LifeHistory
2.2A6.2A$3.A7.A$3.A.2A.3A$4.A.A.A$5.A4$9.2A$9.2A$3C$.CD$.3C!
It can even be hassled by an appropriate P23 domino sparker!
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 5th, 2021, 10:07 pm
by dvgrn
That one has been in the H-to-G collection for quite a while, a couple of versions -- HNE16T14:
Code: Select all
x = 101, y = 67, rule = LifeHistory
60.D3.D.5D3.D4.3D2.5D3.D6.D$60.2D2.D.D6.2D3.D7.D4.2D5.2D$60.D.D.D.D7.
D3.D7.D5.D4.D.D$60.D2.2D.3D5.D3.4D4.D5.D3.D2.D$60.D3.D.D7.D3.D3.D3.D
5.D3.5D$60.D3.D.D7.D3.D3.D3.D5.D6.D$60.D3.D.5D2.3D3.3D4.D4.3D5.D4$76.
B13.4B$71.B3.3B11.4B$D3.D.5D.D3.D3.D4.3D2.5D3.D6.D24.2B.6B8.5B$2D2.D.
D5.D3.D2.2D3.D7.D4.2D5.2D21.5B.7B3.8B$D.D.D.D5.D3.D3.D3.D7.D5.D4.D.D
19.A25B$D2.2D.3D3.D3.D3.D3.4D4.D5.D3.D2.D17.3B2AD23B$D3.D.D5.D.D.D3.D
3.D3.D3.D5.D3.5D16.4BACBD21B.3B$D3.D.D5.2D.2D3.D3.D3.D3.D5.D6.D17.5BD
CDB2A22B$D3.D.5D.D3.D2.3D3.3D4.D4.3D5.D17.B5ABDB2A21B2A$63.4BA25B.B2A
$63.4B2.23B3.B$62.4B5.B2.18B$61.4B9.17B$35.4B21.4B10.17B$34.4B36.19B$
33.4B38.18B$32.4B39.4B2.12B$17.B13.4B46.11B$12.B3.3B11.4B47.8B$11.2B.
6B8.5B48.10B$8.5B.7B3.8B45.A.2AB.4B2.2A$6.A25B43.3AB2AB7.A$4.3B2AD23B
41.A4.B10.3A$4.4BACBD21B.3B38.3A.2A11.A$4.5BDCDB2A22B40.A.A$4.B5ABDB
2A21B2A39.A.A15.4B$4.4BA25B.B2A40.A15.4B$4.4B2.23B3.B56.4B$3.4B5.B2.
18B59.4B$2.4B9.17B59.4B$.4B10.16B45.B13.4B$15.6B2.9B.B37.B3.3B11.4B$
16.5B3.10BA35.2B.6B8.5B$16.4B5.6B.BA.A31.5B.7B3.8B$25.6B2.BA30.A25B$
25.6B32.3B2AD23B$21.A.2AB.4B32.4BACBD21B.3B$19.3AB2AB.3B33.5BDCDB2A
22B$18.A4.B4.4B31.B5ABDB2A21B2A$19.3A.2A5.2A31.4BA25B.B2A$21.A.A6.A
32.4B2.23B3.B$21.A.A7.3A28.4B5.B2.18B$22.A10.A27.4B9.17B$60.4B10.17B$
74.18B$75.18B2.2A$75.4B2.12B3.A$81.14B.A.2A$82.7B4.2A.2A.A$81.10B3.A$
82.5B.B2A.A.A$83.4B.B2AB2A$83.3B4.B$84.2B3.2A.2A$90.A.A$90.A.A$91.A!
Your new version has better clearance for the eater2 in the SW, but to compensate for that, the eater in the SE has to stick out southward a little farther. The block catalyst is in the same place.
An extra good thing about your new version is that it's a merge circuit like the welded-catalyst version (bottom right), but it's Spartan (by slsparse standards) like the other plain-eater2 version of NE16T14 (top right). I think it might well start showing up in self-constructing circuitry as a Snark replacement -- or an improvement on a Snark, really, since a Snark can't be used as a merge circuit. Repeat time is 74, so it's highly single-channel-compatible:
Code: Select all
x = 59, y = 42, rule = LifeHistory
3.A$3.BA51.2B$2.3AB49.4B$3.4B47.4B$4.4B10.A34.4B$5.4B7.3A33.4B$6.4B5.
A21.B13.4B$7.4B4.2A15.B3.3B11.4B$2A6.9B14.2B.6B8.5B$.A7.6B13.5B.7B3.
8B$.A.2A5.6B3.B2.2B2.26B$2.A2.A4.43B$3.2AB3.44B.3B$4.14B2A13B2A22B$5.
13B2A13B2A21B2A$6.48B.B2A$6.17B.4B2.23B3.B$7.15B.4B5.B2.18B$7.19B6.D
2.17B$8.17B5.3D2.16B$10.14B5.D5.6B2.9B.B$9.8B4.2ABA4.2D5.5B3.10BA$9.
6B6.2AB3A4B4.5B5.6B.BA.A$9.5B8.5BAB5.4B7.6B2.BA$9.B.B9.2AB3A4B2.4B8.
6B$10.3B8.BABA11B5.A.2AB.4B$9.B2AB8.BABA10B4.3AB2AB.3B$10.2A9.2BA10B
4.A4.B4.4B$19.2DB.10B6.3A.2A5.2A$18.D.DB3.B2D3B10.A.A6.A$18.D6.B2D3B
10.A.A7.3A$17.2D6.4B13.A10.A$26.3B$27.2B.BD$26.B2DBD.D$25.BDBDBD.D$
23.D2.D.D.D.D.2D$23.4D.2D2.D2.D$27.D4.2D$18.2A5.D.D$17.A.A5.2D$19.A!
I'll be very interested to see if it's possible to compile a HNE16T14maker with 0-degree elbow technology, that's smaller than the current
Snarkmaker. The HNE16T14breaker might be a bit more of a challenge, I suppose, but that won't be all that many gliders compared to the maker.
... Any hope of getting another glider out somewhere, while keeping the Spartan-ness and the 74-tick repeat time? That would
really revolutionize single-channel construction, since SingleChannel74 is (probably) quite a bit more efficient than SingleChannel90.
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 7th, 2021, 5:05 pm
by dvgrn
dvgrn wrote: ↑January 5th, 2021, 10:07 pm
An extra good thing about your new version is that it's a merge circuit like the welded-catalyst version (bottom right), but it's Spartan (by slsparse standards) like the other plain-eater2 version of NE16T14 (top right). I think it might well start showing up in self-constructing circuitry as a Snark replacement -- or an improvement on a Snark, really, since a Snark can't be used as a merge circuit.
The default recipe from slsparse is easily within range of the 0-degree elbow library -- just 57 lanes on one side of the key lane, and 41 lanes on the other:
Code: Select all
x = 156, y = 57, rule = LifeHistory
2$69.B9.B$68.3B5.5B$67.7B.7B$42.B24.16B$41.3B23.19B$31.BA8.2BA21.22B$
21.3B5.3B3A5.2BABAB17.24B6.B$21.4B.9BA4.2BABA3B14.24B6.3B.3B4.3B$13.B
.3B.15B2A4.B2AB3A2B13.25B3.9B4.5B$12.26B.8BA7B7.A11B2A24B2.8B$12.29B
2AB3A9B5.ABA10B2A35B$11.30B2ABA12B4.ABA48B$11.46B2.3AB2A47B$13.18BA
24B2.A54B$14.16BABA22B3.B3AB2A48B$14.17BA23B2.4BAB2A49B$12.43B.58B$
10.103B$8.105B$7.105B$8.105B$10.18B2A84B$12.16B2A21B2A13B2A47B$13.38B
2A13B2A47B$13.68B2A32B$13.67BA2BA32B$14.61B.5B2ABA32B$18.57B2.7BA33B$
18.56B4.6B2A33B$18.51B2A4B4.41B$18.52BA5B4.41B$19.48B3A7B4.41B$20.47B
A10B4.41B$21.58B4.41B$21.59B4.41B$22.59B4.41B$22.2B.57B4.41B$24.59B4.
41B$23.61B4.41B$22.4B2.57B4.41B$21.4B4.57B4.41B$20.4B6.57B4.41B$19.4B
8.57B4.41B$18.4B10.57B4.41B$17.4B12.57B4.41B$16.4B14.57B4.41B$15.4B
16.57B4.41B$14.4B18.57B4.41B$13.4B20.57B4.41B$12.4B22.57B4.41B$11.4B
24.57B4.41B$10.4B26.57B4.41B$9.4B28.57B2.2C41B$8.4B30.57B.C.C41B$7.4B
32.57BC3.41B!
It takes 156 gliders to build this merge circuit/reflector from a block:
Code: Select all
x = 1293, y = 1280, rule = B3/S23
2o$2o4$2bo$b2o$bobo11$12bo$11b2o$11bobo$29b3o$29bo$30bo8$21b3o$21bo$
22bo3$20bo$19b2o$19bobo3$22bo$21b2o16bo$21bobo8b3o3b2o$32bo5bobo$33bo
21$57bo$56b2o$56bobo7$52bo$51b2o$51bobo5$83bo$82b2o$82bobo11$93bo$92b
2o$92bobo5$108bo$107b2o$107bobo3$102bo$101b2o$101bobo3$97b3o$97bo$98bo
21bo$119b2o$119bobo4$123bo$122b2o$122bobo4$153b3o$153bo$154bo8$166b3o$
166bo$167bo2$182bo$181b2o$181bobo9$170bo5b3o3bo$169b2o5bo4b2o$169bobo
5bo3bobo9$183b3o$183bo$184bo10$194b3o$194bo$195bo17$214bo$213b2o$213bo
bo$218bo$217b2o$217bobo13$234bo$233b2o$233bobo3bo$238b2o$238bobo5$232b
3o$232bo$233bo13$238b3o4b3o$238bo6bo$239bo6bo6$242b3o$242bo$243bo$256b
o$255b2o$255bobo5$281b3o$281bo$282bo20$315b3o$315bo$316bo3$321bo$320b
2o$320bobo12$329b3o$329bo$330bo$349bo$348b2o$348bobo8$361bo$360b2o$
360bobo8$362b3o$362bo$363bo37$350b3o$350bo$351bo11$359b3o$359bo$360bo
8$371b3o$371bo$372bo5$355bo$354b2o$354bobo$417b3o$417bo$418bo8$364bo$
363b2o$363bobo13$371bo$370b2o$370bobo$375b3o62b3o$375bo64bo$376bo64bo
36$479b3o$479bo$480bo$453b3o$453bo$454bo20$491b3o$491bo$492bo3$495b3o$
495bo$496bo19$481b3o$481bo$482bo16$479b3o$479bo$480bo6$519b3o$519bo$
520bo9$515bo$514b2o$514bobo4$523bo$522b2o$522bobo10$530b3o$530bo$531bo
$535b3o$535bo$536bo9$546b3o$546bo$547bo12$574bo$573b2o$573bobo12$587bo
$586b2o$577b3o6bobo$577bo$578bo2$582bo$581b2o$581bobo2$600bo$599b2o$
599bobo$610bo$609b2o$609bobo4$602bo$601b2o$601bobo13$605bo$604b2o$604b
obo18b3o$625bo$626bo2$606b3o$606bo$607bo2$621bo$620b2o$620bobo11$630bo
$629b2o$629bobo5$645bo$644b2o$644bobo10$655b3o$655bo$656bo4$676bo$675b
2o$675bobo6$693bo$692b2o$692bobo6$682b3o$682bo$683bo6b3o$690bo$691bo
21$719b3o$719bo$720bo2$723b3o$723bo$724bo7$725bo$724b2o$724bobo8$738bo
$737b2o$737bobo5$745bo$744b2o$744bobo6$748bo$747b2o$747bobo5bo$754b2o$
754bobo$743b3o$743bo$744bo2$757b3o$757bo$758bo13$824b3o$824bo$825bo9$
800bo$799b2o$799bobo3$803b3o$803bo$804bo$793b3o$793bo$794bo2$798b3o$
798bo$799bo7$832bo$811b3o17b2o$811bo19bobo$812bo2$826b3o$826bo$827bo$
818b3o$818bo$819bo$843bo$842b2o$842bobo4$831bo$830b2o$830bobo8$869b3o$
835bo33bo$834b2o34bo$834bobo3$846bo$845b2o$845bobo2$877b3o$877bo$878bo
2$847b3o23bo7b3o$847bo24b2o7bo$848bo23bobo7bo2$876b3o$876bo$877bo7$
891b3o$891bo$892bo15bo$876b3o28b2o$876bo30bobo$877bo4$868b3o$868bo$
869bo2$900bo$867b3o29b2o$867bo31bobo$868bo2$914b3o$914bo$915bo3$867b3o
$867bo$868bo2$938b3o$938bo$939bo9$875b3o$875bo12b3o49b3o$876bo11bo51bo
$889bo51bo2$880b3o$880bo$881bo42bo$923b2o$923bobo11$934bo$933b2o$933bo
bo12$950bo10bo$937b3o9b2o9b2o$937bo11bobo8bobo$938bo$942b3o$942bo$943b
o3$984bo$983b2o$983bobo$972b3o$972bo$973bo5$1004bo$1003b2o$1003bobo$
997bo$996b2o$990bo5bobo$989b2o$989bobo$1026b3o$1026bo$965b3o59bo$965bo
$966bo17$967b3o$967bo$968bo9$979b3o$979bo$980bo3$979b3o$979bo$980bo3$
985bo$984b2o$984bobo11$995bo$994b2o$994bobo60b3o$1003bo53bo$1002b2o54b
o$1002bobo7bo$1011b2o$1011bobo37b3o$1051bo$1007b3o42bo$1007bo64b3o$
1008bo63bo$1073bo$1012b3o62b3o$1012bo64bo$1013bo64bo2$1009b3o$1009bo$
1010bo$1094b3o$1074b3o17bo$1074bo20bo$1075bo$1098bo$1097b2o$1018bo78bo
bo$1017b2o65b3o$1017bobo64bo$1085bo7$1109bo$1108b2o$1108bobo14$1101b3o
$1101bo$1102bo8$1122b3o$1122bo$1123bo185$1290b2o$1290bobo$1290bo!
This is more than the 96 slow gliders currently needed to build a Snark starting from a block. But again, this is a merge circuit and the Snark isn't. This will come in really handy when building out things like memory loops, where a second copy of the build recipe is going to come in on the same lane, to be caught by the loop. This NE16T14c reflector can be built at the final corner, and the second copy of the recipe will go right through it.
There are several possible optimization avenues to explore, that would probably get the final NE16T14c single-channel recipe down to somewhat smaller than the current Snarkmaker. But then, the Snarkmaker recipe could also be optimized down to about half of its current size -- this is one of those places where there's an obvious line of research that no one has gotten around to tackling yet.
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 7th, 2021, 5:34 pm
by dvgrn
dvgrn wrote: ↑January 7th, 2021, 5:05 pm
The default recipe from slsparse is easily within range of the 0-degree elbow library -- just 57 lanes on one side of the key lane, and 41 lanes on the other...It takes 156 gliders to build this merge circuit/reflector from a block...
As usual, there's only a small cost to reducing the construction lane width. In fact, it looks like adding a width restriction makes for a somewhat cheaper result in this case. Experimenting with an infile.mc along these lines --
Code: Select all
x = 166, y = 150, rule = B3/S23
4bo10bo$4b3o7bobo$7bo6bobo$6b2o5b2ob3o$19bo14bo11b2o$13b2ob3o14bobo10b
2o$13b2obo16bobo$31b3ob2o$3bo26bo$2bobo26b3ob2o$3bo29bob2o6$2o$2o21b2o
13b2o$23b2o13b2o$53b2o$52bo2bo$53b2obo$56bo$56b2o$41b2o$42bo$39b3o$39b
o$96b2o63b2o$96bobo61bobo$97bobo59bobo$98bobo57bobo$99bobo55bobo$100bo
bo53bobo$101bobo51bobo$102bobo49bobo$103bobo47bobo$104bobo45bobo$105bo
bo43bobo$106bobo41bobo$107bobo39bobo$108bobo37bobo$109bobo35bobo$110bo
bo33bobo$111bobo31bobo$112bobo29bobo$113bobo27bobo$114bobo25bobo$115bo
bo23bobo$116bobo21bobo$117bobo19bobo$118bobo17bobo$119bobo15bobo$120bo
bo13bobo$121bobo11bobo$122bobo9bobo$123bobo7bobo$124bobo5bobo$125bobo
3bobo$126bobobobo$127b2ob2o23$46b2o$46bobo$47bobo$48bobo$49bobo$50bobo
$51bobo$52bobo$53bobo$54bobo$55bobo$56bobo$57bobo$58bobo$59bobo$60bobo
$61bobo$62bobo$63bobo$64bobo$65bobo$66bobo$67bobo$68bobo$69bobo$70bobo
$71bobo$72bobo$73bobo$74bobo$75bobo$76bobo$77b2o2$77b2o$76bobo$75bobo$
74bobo$73bobo$72bobo$71bobo$70bobo$69bobo91b2o$68bobo91bo2bo$67bobo91b
o2bo$66bobo93b2o$65bobo$64bobo95b2o$63bobo96b2o$62bobo$61bobo$60bobo$
59bobo$58bobo$57bobo$56bobo$55bobo$54bobo$53bobo$52bobo$51bobo$50bobo$
49bobo$48bobo$47bobo$46bobo$46b2o!
-- I ended up with a 147-glider recipe that's only 50 lanes on one side of the key lane, and 34 lanes on the other:
Code: Select all
x = 1115, y = 1066, rule = B3/S23
2o$2o4$b2o$bobo$bo10$17b2o$17bobo$17bo16$21bo$20b2o$20bobo6$36bo$35b2o
$35bobo$45b2o$45bobo$45bo3$46b2o$46bobo$46bo4$59b2o$59bobo$59bo3$61b2o
$42b2o17bobo$42bobo16bo$42bo14$84b2o$84bobo$84bo9$84bo$83b2o$83bobo10$
95bo$94b2o$94bobo11$123bo$122b2o$122bobo2$126bo$125b2o$125bobo3$134bo$
133b2o$133bobo6$125bo$124b2o$124bobo2$129b2o14bo$129bobo12b2o$129bo14b
obo18$165b2o$165bobo$165bo6bo$171b2o$171bobo2$176bo$175b2o$175bobo4$
184b2o$184bobo$184bo33$209b2o$209bobo$209bo3$207b2o$207bobo$207bo8$
220b2o$220bobo$220bo$230b2o$230bobo$230bo4$222b2o$222bobo$222bo13$225b
2o$225bobo19bo$225bo20b2o$246bobo2$228bo$227b2o$227bobo3$241b2o$241bob
o$241bo11$250b2o$250bobo$250bo5$265b2o$265bobo$265bo9$277bo$276b2o$
276bobo5$296b2o$296bobo$296bo6$313b2o$313bobo$313bo5$304bo$303b2o$303b
obo6bo$311b2o$311bobo21$341bo$340b2o$340bobo2$345bo$344b2o$344bobo8$
345b2o$345bobo$345bo8$358b2o$358bobo$358bo5$365b2o$365bobo$365bo6$368b
2o$368bobo$368bo6b2o$375bobo$365bo9bo$364b2o$364bobo2$379bo$378b2o$
378bobo25$420b2o$420bobo$420bo2$425bo$424b2o$424bobo$415bo$414b2o$414b
obo2$420bo$419b2o$419bobo8$433bo19bo$432b2o18b2o$432bobo17bobo2$448bo$
447b2o$447bobo$440bo$439b2o$439bobo8$451b2o$451bobo$451bo9$455b2o$455b
obo$455bo3$466b2o$466bobo$466bo5$469bo$468b2o$468bobo8$507bo$506b2o$
506bobo4$498bo$497b2o$497bobo4$490bo$489b2o$489bobo$514b2o$514bobo$
489bo24bo$488b2o$488bobo15$524b2o23bo$524bobo21b2o$524bo23bobo11$550bo
$549b2o$549bobo5$547bo$546b2o$546bobo11$557bo$556b2o$556bobo$572b2o$
572bobo$572bo5$572bo$571b2o$571bobo3$561b2o9b2o$561bobo8bobo$561bo10bo
10bo$582b2o$582bobo9$595bo$594b2o$594bobo17$614b2o$614bobo$614bo2$617b
2o$617bobo$617bo13$641bo$632b2o6b2o$632bobo5bobo$632bo3$634b2o20bo$
634bobo18b2o$634bo20bobo2$664bo$663b2o$663bobo$656bo$655b2o$655bobo8$
667b2o$667bobo$667bo24$674bo$673b2o$673bobo32$696bo$695b2o$695bobo3$
701b2o$701bobo$701bo7$715bo$714b2o$714bobo17$718b2o$718bobo$718bo10$
728b2o$728bobo$728bo9bo$737b2o$737bobo53$810bo$809b2o$809bobo16$820bo$
819b2o$819bobo3$838bo$837b2o$837bobo8$868b2o$868bobo$868bo11$878b2o$
878bobo$878bo4$898bo$885b2o10b2o$885bobo9bobo$885bo2$900bo$899b2o$899b
obo$890bo$889b2o$876bo12bobo$875b2o$875bobo15$910bo$909b2o$909bobo31$
893bo$892b2o$892bobo58b2o$953bobo$953bo$930b2o$930bobo$930bo8$901bo$
900b2o12bo$900bobo10b2o$913bobo23b2o$939bobo$906bo32bo$905b2o$905bobo
7$925bo$924b2o$924bobo$952bo$945b2o4b2o$945bobo3bobo17bo$945bo24b2o$
970bobo3$965bo$937bo26b2o$936b2o26bobo$936bobo2$969b2o$937bo31bobo$
936b2o31bo$936bobo4$941b2o$941bobo$941bo4$979b2o$979bobo$979bo2$1013b
2o$1013bobo$1013bo$951b2o$951bobo$951bo$959b2o$959bobo$959bo8b2o$968bo
bo$968bo15bo10b2o9b2o$965bo17b2o10bobo8bobo$964b2o17bobo9bo10bo$964bob
o22bo$988b2o$970bo17bobo$969b2o$969bobo2$967bo$966b2o$966bobo50bo$
1018b2o$1018bobo6$974b2o52b2o13bo$974bobo51bobo2b2o7b2o$974bo53bo4bobo
6bobo$1033bo14bo$1047b2o$1047bobo3$1048bo$1012bo34b2o$1011b2o34bobo$
1011bobo5$1063bo$1062b2o$1062bobo$1068bo$1067b2o$1067bobo5$1085bo$
1065bo18b2o$1064b2o18bobo$1064bobo2$1087b2o$1087bobo$1075bo11bo$1074b
2o$1074bobo8$1098b2o$1098bobo$1098bo13$1092bo$1091b2o$1091bobo8$1113bo
$1112b2o$1112bobo!
It would take a bit more experimenting to find the optimal width (according to slsparse) -- especially because 0-degree elbow recipes get gradually more expensive as lanes get farther from the elbow, so a narrower recipe will ultimately have a shorter single-channel recipe on average.
A hand-optimized slow salvo recipe might also end up taking a good percentage off the total glider count, if anyone wants to have a look at that.
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 7th, 2021, 6:00 pm
by MathAndCode
dvgrn wrote: ↑January 7th, 2021, 5:34 pm
I ended up with a 147-glider recipe that's only 50 lanes on one side of the key lane, and 34 lanes on the other:
Wouldn't there need to be a new target block on the output lane, though?
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 7th, 2021, 6:06 pm
by bubblegum
Why is EE's HNE16T14 variant labeled "NEW16T14"? Specifically, what's the W doing there?
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 7th, 2021, 7:18 pm
by dvgrn
bubblegum wrote: ↑January 7th, 2021, 6:06 pm
Why is EE's HNE16T14 variant labeled "NEW16T14"? Specifically, what's the W doing there?
It's not really there... I added the "W" in the pattern because, um, the variant was NEW.
Really that label should probably say "NE16T14c".
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 7th, 2021, 7:21 pm
by dvgrn
MathAndCode wrote: ↑January 7th, 2021, 6:00 pm
dvgrn wrote: ↑January 7th, 2021, 5:34 pm
I ended up with a 147-glider recipe that's only 50 lanes on one side of the key lane, and 34 lanes on the other:
Wouldn't there need to be a new target block on the output lane, though?
Definitely! But that's a separate part of the recipe, not included in the 0-degree slow salvo comparison I was doing.
The Snarkmaker recipe has a chunk of single-channel recipe at the beginning that builds a new target block off to the side, also. Those gliders aren't included in the tally of 96 slow-salvo gliders fired by the temporary 0-degree elbow.
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 7th, 2021, 11:51 pm
by MathAndCode
Is there a tub replacement that works in this situation?
Code: Select all
x = 11, y = 13, rule = LifeHistory
2.A$.A.A$.DA$.3D$.D.D$3.D2$3C$C.C$C.C4.2A$7.A.A$9.A$9.2A!
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 8th, 2021, 6:55 am
by dvgrn
MathAndCode wrote: ↑January 7th, 2021, 11:51 pm
Is there a tub replacement that works in this situation?
Code: Select all
x = 11, y = 13, rule = LifeHistory
2.A$.A.A$.DA$.3D$.D.D$3.D2$3C$C.C$C.C4.2A$7.A.A$9.A$9.2A!
You just want a catalyst that produces that huge leftward spark, right? Why is there a marked Herschel in there?
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 8th, 2021, 8:04 am
by yujh
dvgrn wrote: ↑January 8th, 2021, 6:55 am
MathAndCode wrote: ↑January 7th, 2021, 11:51 pm
Is there a tub replacement that works in this situation?
Code: Select all
x = 11, y = 13, rule = LifeHistory
2.A$.A.A$.DA$.3D$.D.D$3.D2$3C$C.C$C.C4.2A$7.A.A$9.A$9.2A!
You just want a catalyst that produces that huge leftward spark, right? Why is there a marked Herschel in there?
This guy is very wierd, but i think they meant The thing is a Pi2H( OK I don't know how to describe this clearly), and if you get rid of the tub and eater at gen 10 or 11(also the spark that destroys the eater) results the same as putting a herschel there.
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 8th, 2021, 8:54 am
by wwei23
Oh, I see! It's H'!
EDIT:
Code: Select all
x = 15, y = 22, rule = LifeHistory
.2A7.2A$.A2.2A.2A2.A$2.2A.A.A.2A$3.A.A.A.A$3.A.3A.A$4.5A4$5.3A$6.A$6.
A3$2.D$.2D5.2D$2D2.3C2.D$.D.DC.CD.D$2.2DC.C2D!
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 8th, 2021, 11:29 am
by MathAndCode
dvgrn wrote: ↑January 8th, 2021, 6:55 am
You just want a catalyst that produces that huge leftward spark, right? Why is there a marked Herschel in there?
It's a Herschel without its first natural glider.
Code: Select all
x = 22, y = 16, rule = LifeHistory
19.D$19.3D$17.A.D.D$16.A4.D$15.A$15.A$15.A.A$2A14.2A$2A$6.2A$6.2A3$4.
2A$4.2A5.2A$11.2A!
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 8th, 2021, 12:41 pm
by bubblegum
MathAndCode wrote: ↑January 8th, 2021, 11:29 am
It's a Herschel without its first natural glider.
It might've been clearer to mark the H' object itself, rather than the base Herschel. (Or its base B, or
its base R, or…)
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 8th, 2021, 8:52 pm
by MathAndCode
Can a permanent catalyst replace the block?
Code: Select all
x = 12, y = 13, rule = LifeHistory
2.2A$2.2A4$3.C6.2A$2.3C6.A$2.C5.3A$.D6.A$D8.2A$3D7.A$9.A$9.2A!
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 8th, 2021, 9:58 pm
by wwei23
MathAndCode wrote: ↑January 8th, 2021, 8:52 pm
Can a permanent catalyst replace the block?
Hm. I was able to stabilize it by block-faced catalyst. It still remains to be seen: Can a stable catalyst replace the periodic one?
Code: Select all
x = 26, y = 35, rule = B3/S23
6b2o10b2o$7bo10bo$6bo12bo$3bo2b4o6b4o2bo$3b3o4bo4bo4b3o$6bo2bobo2bobo
2bo$3b4o3bo4bo3b4o$2bo2bo14bo2bo$2b2o3b2o8b2o3b2o$6bo12bo$2b5o4b4o4b5o
$bobo2b2ob8ob2o2bobo$bobobobo10bobobobo$2obobo3bob4obo3bobob2o$bobo3bo
b2o4b2obo3bobo$o2bob2o3bob2obo3b2obo2bo$obobob2o3bo2bo3b2obobobo$b2obo
2b3obo2bob3o2bob2o$4bo7b2o7bo$4bobo5b2o5bobo$5bobobob4obobobo$6bo3bo4b
o3bo2$11bo2bo4$13bo6b2o$12b3o6bo$12bo5b3o$18bo$19b2o$20bo$19bo$19b2o!
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 11th, 2021, 5:16 pm
by MathAndCode
Kazyan wrote: ↑November 20th, 2020, 12:41 pm
LLS now gives us the tools to investigate whether a stable chainable version exists. Unfortunately, my searches suggest that it's unlikely that an elementary, symmetric chainable catalyst exists at low-ish repeat times.
I just found these reactions. Could they be useful?
Code: Select all
x = 27, y = 10, rule = B3/S23
2o22bo$bo21bobo$bobo19bo2bo$2b2o20b2o4$12b3o$12bobo$12bobo!
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 11th, 2021, 5:27 pm
by bubblegum
MathAndCode wrote: ↑January 11th, 2021, 5:16 pm
I just found these reactions. Could they be useful?
A ship+eater with extra eater works for this, although we are yet to find a stable chainable version.
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 11th, 2021, 5:44 pm
by MathAndCode
bubblegum wrote: ↑January 11th, 2021, 5:27 pm
We are yet to find a stable chainable version.
That's what I was hoping the reactions would help with.
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 11th, 2021, 8:43 pm
by Entity Valkyrie 2
This leaves a pair of boats every 30 generations:
Code: Select all
x = 27, y = 46, rule = B3/S23
2o23b2o$bo23bo$bobo19bobo$2b2o19b2o6$2o23b2o$bo23bo$bobo19bobo$2b2o19b
2o6$2o23b2o$bo23bo$bobo19bobo$2b2o19b2o6$2o23b2o$bo23bo$bobo19bobo$2b
2o19b2o6$2o23b2o$bo23bo$bobo19bobo$2b2o19b2o3$12b3o$11bo3bo$11b2ob2o!
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 12th, 2021, 4:12 pm
by MathAndCode
MathAndCode wrote: ↑January 5th, 2021, 3:52 pm
Code: Select all
x = 11, y = 11, rule = B3/S23
7b2o$7b2o2$2o$2o4$9bo$8b3o$8bo!
Here's an R→S:
Code: Select all
x = 28, y = 16, rule = LifeHistory
13.2A$14.A5.2D$14.A.A4.2D$15.2A5.2D2$7.2A$7.2A17.2A$26.2A$2A$2A4$9.C$
8.3C$8.C!
Unfortunately, it doesn't have good output clearance.
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 13th, 2021, 1:48 pm
by MathAndCode
Here is a Q→R conduit:
Code: Select all
x = 13, y = 12, rule = LifeHistory
12.A$10.3A$9.A$9.2A3$6.D$2A2.3D$2A3.D.C$6.3C$5.5C$4.2C3.2C!
Here are a couple of mostly-complete Q→C conduits:
Code: Select all
x = 13, y = 12, rule = LifeHistory
A$3A4.2A$3.A3.2A$2.2A4$9.2D$7.C2.3D$6.3C2.D$5.5C$4.2C3.2C!
Code: Select all
x = 18, y = 15, rule = LifeHistory
17.A$15.3A$2A12.A$.A6.D5.2A$.A.A3.3D$2.2A5.2D3$12.C$11.3C$10.5C$5.2A2.
2C3.2C$6.A$3.3A$3.A!
Here is a mostly-complete Q→R conduit:
Code: Select all
x = 17, y = 12, rule = LifeHistory
8.2A$8.2A5.2A$15.A$13.A.A$13.2A$.A$A.A$2A6.C$7.3C$6.5C$5.2C.2D2C$8.D!
Edit: Here's a W→G:
Code: Select all
x = 12, y = 16, rule = LifeHistory
5.3D$7.D$6.D$3.2C$4.C.C$5.2C3.2A$10.2A4$2A$2A3.A$4.A.A$5.A.A$7.A$7.2A!
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 13th, 2021, 2:23 pm
by dvgrn
MathAndCode wrote: ↑January 13th, 2021, 1:48 pm
Here is a Q→R conduit...
Here are a couple of mostly-complete Q→C conduits...
Here is a mostly-complete Q→R conduit...
I think I've mentioned this before, but I'm hoping that posts in this thread can be mostly limited to conduits that are completely in working order, that can be demonstrated to be connectable to some other known conduit on both the input and the output.
This thread is 48 pages already, and piling a lot of not-quite-working stuff in it makes it hard to find the useful conduits.
Does anyone mind if I move a pile of posts about not-quite-working mechanisms over to a new
Speculative Elementary Conduits thread? They can move right back as soon as they've been demonstrated to actually recover correctly, and connect to other conduits in a useful way.
(However, if for example the W-to-G at the end of the last post does connect to some known X-to-W, then it should be posted in the
Hunting of the Elementary Conduits thread, not this one.)
EDIT about wwei23's post, below:
This is a thread about stable Herschel conduits. Can someone please explain why it seems like a good idea to post non-stable non-Herschel non-conduits here?
Re: The Hunting of the New Herschel Conduits
Posted: January 13th, 2021, 4:10 pm
by wwei23
MathAndCode wrote: ↑January 13th, 2021, 1:48 pm
Here is a mostly-complete Q→R conduit:
Code: Select all
x = 17, y = 12, rule = LifeHistory
8.2A$8.2A5.2A$15.A$13.A.A$13.2A$.A$A.A$2A6.C$7.3C$6.5C$5.2C.2D2C$8.D!
Code: Select all
x = 19, y = 15, rule = LifeHistory
.2A$.2A2$.A8.2A$A.A7.2A5.2A$A2.A13.A$.A2.A10.A.A$15.2A$.A2.A$.2A$10.C
$9.3C$8.5C$7.2C.2D2C$10.D!