Reflectorless Rotating Oscillators (RRO)

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GUYTU6J
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Re: Reflectorless Rotating Oscillators (RRO)

Post by GUYTU6J » December 17th, 2019, 12:16 am

Cross-posting this p14136 from the 5s thread, which I think is actually the unloopable RRO with highest known period:

Code: Select all

x = 7, y = 5, rule = B2in3aijqr4ikqz5r6n/S2aek3-ae4city5-ejqy6a7e
2bo$b3o$2obo$bobo$4bobo!
Source:viewtopic.php?f=11&t=2892&start=600#p79581

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77topaz
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Re: Reflectorless Rotating Oscillators (RRO)

Post by 77topaz » December 18th, 2019, 4:23 am

The thing is, it's dubious whether that oscillator fits the definition of an RRO because of those temporary ponds.

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Re: Reflectorless Rotating Oscillators (RRO)

Post by Entity Valkyrie 2 » December 23rd, 2019, 8:02 pm

77topaz wrote:
December 18th, 2019, 4:23 am
The thing is, it's dubious whether that oscillator fits the definition of an RRO because of those temporary ponds.
The definition of RRO is that it is a "reflectorless rotating oscillator".

The ponds are not "reflectors".
The ENEERG-y of the EVAD is watching.
The 70th NAI-ve guy is watching.

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Re: Reflectorless Rotating Oscillators (RRO)

Post by Hdjensofjfnen » December 24th, 2019, 2:35 pm

77topaz wrote:
December 18th, 2019, 4:23 am
The thing is, it's dubious whether that oscillator fits the definition of an RRO because of those temporary ponds.
I would say it is an RRO -- you see loopable RROs with temporary-object mechanics like the one posted. Indeed, the RRO in my signature has temporary clusters of blocks as well.
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'Sir, I exist!'
'However,' replied the universe,
'The fact has not created in me
A sense of obligation.'" -Stephen Crane

Code: Select all

x = 7, y = 5, rule = B3/S2-i3-y4i
4b3o$6bo$o3b3o$2o$bo!

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Re: Reflectorless Rotating Oscillators (RRO)

Post by Hdjensofjfnen » January 13th, 2020, 1:50 am

Double-posting, but there exists an p200 RRO of loopabilities 1, 2, and 4 in a rule four transitions from Life:

Code: Select all

x = 125, y = 28, rule = B3-j6i/S23-c4i
3o46b3o46b3o$o5bobo40bo5bobo40bo5bobo15b3o$2o3bo2bo40b2o3bo2bo40b2o3bo
2bo15bobo$6bobo46bobo46bobo17bo3$122bo$121bobo2$121b3o9$98b3o2$98bobo$
99bo3$66bobo28bo17bobo$66bo2bo3b2o22bobo15bo2bo3b2o$66bobo5bo22b3o15bo
bo5bo$72b3o46b3o!
"A man said to the universe:
'Sir, I exist!'
'However,' replied the universe,
'The fact has not created in me
A sense of obligation.'" -Stephen Crane

Code: Select all

x = 7, y = 5, rule = B3/S2-i3-y4i
4b3o$6bo$o3b3o$2o$bo!

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Re: Reflectorless Rotating Oscillators (RRO)

Post by GUYTU6J » January 29th, 2020, 12:44 am

How about "meta-RRO"s, i.e. RRO-like structures that rotate reflectorlessly?
p1404 from here

Code: Select all

x = 55, y = 43, rule = B2kn3-kq4ci5e/S23-aeny4ceikry6ci7c8
24b3o$24bobo$26bo$23b2o2bo$26bo$27b3o3$24b2o$24b2o$23bobo$18bo$14bo2bo
6bo$14bo3bo3bo$17bob2o$18b2obobo$17b6o4$45b2o$45bo$4b3o38b3o$3bo41b2o$
b3o3b2o37b2o$2o4b3o39bo$bo$3bobobo$4b2o41b2o$5bob2o15b2o$5b3o15bo2bo$
6bo17bob2o$23b3ob2o$24b2obo20bo$23bobo24bo$25bo$48bobobo$20bo31bo$19bo
30b3o$16bo34bobo$19b2o31b3o$17bobo$17b3o!
This is perhaps a meta-meta-RRO: p19172 from here

Code: Select all

x = 13, y = 8, rule = B2kn3-ekqr4ik5nq8/S2-n3ijkqr4ceikqr5e6a
3bo$3bo$o2bo$3o4$10b3o!
EDIT: There're more from those results
p1492

Code: Select all

x = 5, y = 4, rule = B2kn3-kqr4i5ceq/S23ijkqr4eikqr6a7e
3o2$bo2bo$b3o!
p1524

Code: Select all

x = 9, y = 80, rule = B2kn3-ekqr4ciq5eqy6n/S2-n3-aeny4eiknqr5jk6ac7
3b3o$2b2obo$3bo2bo$6b2o$4bo3bo$4b2o2bo$7b2o66$2b2o$2b2obo$5bo$bo3bo$o
3bo$4bo$bobo$b3o!
p1732

Code: Select all

x = 5, y = 4, rule = B2kn3-ekqr4ciq5enq6n8/S2-n3-aeny4eikqr5aek6-ek7c
2b3o$bo2bo$4bo$o!
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77topaz
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Re: Reflectorless Rotating Oscillators (RRO)

Post by 77topaz » January 30th, 2020, 5:34 am

Hdjensofjfnen wrote:
January 13th, 2020, 1:50 am
Double-posting, but there exists an p200 RRO of loopabilities 1, 2, and 4 in a rule four transitions from Life:

Code: Select all

x = 125, y = 28, rule = B3-j6i/S23-c4i
3o46b3o46b3o$o5bobo40bo5bobo40bo5bobo15b3o$2o3bo2bo40b2o3bo2bo40b2o3bo
2bo15bobo$6bobo46bobo46bobo17bo3$122bo$121bobo2$121b3o9$98b3o2$98bobo$
99bo3$66bobo28bo17bobo$66bo2bo3b2o22bobo15bo2bo3b2o$66bobo5bo22b3o15bo
bo5bo$72b3o46b3o!
This rule is practically unapgsearchable (<0.1 soups/sec search speed) due to soups regularly expanding to thousands of objects in size (though they never seem to outright explode). Adding one transition, S4e, preserves the RRO but stabilises the rule enough to be apgsearchable.

Said rule has some interesting patterns, including a very wide but natural puffer:

Code: Select all

x = 16, y = 16, rule = B3-j6i/S23-c4ei
bo5b2o2b5o$2b2ob2o2b2o2b3o$2bobob2ob3o2bo$2bo2b2obob3o2bo$2obo2b2obo4b
2o$2bob2obob3o2b2o$bobob4o4b2o$b3o2bo6bobo$b3o2bo$5b6ob2obo$obo3bobobo
4bo$3bobo2b3o4bo$2b2ob2obo2bo2bo$b3ob2o$bo4bob2obobobo$2ob6o2bob3o!
Another natural puffer with a long trail of active smoke:

Code: Select all

x = 16, y = 16, rule = B3-j6i/S23-c4ei
bob2obo2b2ob2obo$ob2o5b2o4bo$ob2o3bobo2b3o$o4bobo3b3o$4ob3ob2obo2bo$o
2bob5o2b2obo$3b2o4bo2b4o$2o4bob2ob5o$2obob2o3bob4o$b2o2b2o3b3ob2o$5b2o
3b2ob2o$obo5bo$ob5obo2bob2o$bobo2bob2o3bobo$bobobobobo4bo$5ob4obo3bo!
A natural 10c/20 ship (that also works without S4e):

Code: Select all

x = 7, y = 5, rule = B3-j6i/S23-c4ei
b3o$5o$2bo2b2o$6bo$4b3o!
And also various interesting oscillators that can be seen on the Catagolue page.

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Re: Reflectorless Rotating Oscillators (RRO)

Post by 77topaz » February 2nd, 2020, 7:46 am

77topaz wrote:
January 30th, 2020, 5:34 am
Hdjensofjfnen wrote:
January 13th, 2020, 1:50 am
Double-posting, but there exists an p200 RRO of loopabilities 1, 2, and 4 in a rule four transitions from Life:

Code: Select all

x = 125, y = 28, rule = B3-j6i/S23-c4i
3o46b3o46b3o$o5bobo40bo5bobo40bo5bobo15b3o$2o3bo2bo40b2o3bo2bo40b2o3bo
2bo15bobo$6bobo46bobo46bobo17bo3$122bo$121bobo2$121b3o9$98b3o2$98bobo$
99bo3$66bobo28bo17bobo$66bo2bo3b2o22bobo15bo2bo3b2o$66bobo5bo22b3o15bo
bo5bo$72b3o46b3o!
This rule is practically unapgsearchable (<0.1 soups/sec search speed) due to soups regularly expanding to thousands of objects in size (though they never seem to outright explode).
I'd forgotten apgsearch had a function where you could submit a haul with under 10k soups if it had more than 250k objects. Turns out a 396-soup haul had enough objects, and a 100-soup haul may also have been enough. :P The 396-soup haul had an average of 2820 objects per soup, which has to be the largest I've seen for a non-explosive rule.

The non-S4e rule has its own highly dirty but natural c/2 orthogonal puffer (appears after about 15k gens (!) in this soup):

Code: Select all

x = 16, y = 16, rule = B3-j6i/S23-c4i
2o2bo7b2obo$3ob6obo2bo$ob3o3bob2obo$ob4ob7obo$bo3bob2obobob2o$b5o2bo3b
obo$bobob4o3b4o$ob2o2b2o3b2o2bo$5obobob6o$obob4o2bobob2o$b4o8b3o$b2o2b
o2b2o2bo2bo$o3b3o4bobo$2bob6o4bo$b2ob3o3bo2bobo$2b2o4b3obob2o!
A slightly less dirty one, appears after about 5k gens:

Code: Select all

x = 16, y = 16, rule = B3-j6i/S23-c4i
o2b2o3b2o2b2o$b5obob2o2b2o$5ob2o5b2o$4b4obo$o5bob5ob2o$2bob3o3b5o$2b2o
bobo2bobo$bo3bo3b7o$o2b6ob2ob3o$2b2o5bobob2o$2b5o2bobo2b2o$bo4bobob2o
3bo$4obo2b3obobo$ob3o3b3obob2o$bo6b5obo$o3bobo2bob2obo!
There's even some soups tagged as zz_REPLICATOR or zz_LINEAR, though I think none of them actually have replicators (most don't even have linear growth (sub)patterns), they're actually very expansive methuselae. And this rule definitely loves methuselae!

EDIT: An extremely smoky puffer that was tagged as zz_LINEAR emerges from this soup after about 3k gens:

Code: Select all

x = 16, y = 16, rule = B3-j6i/S23-c4i
bob3o2bo4b3o$bo4b3o4b3o$bobob6obo$b3o2b2o2b4o$2b4o2b4obo$bo2bobobob2o$
o3b3obo5bo$ob3o2b9o$2b2ob10o$2bobob2ob2o2bobo$bob4o4bo3bo$2b2obob2o2bo
2b2o$2obo7b2o$2o2b2obo2b2o2b2o$4bobobobob3o$bob2o2bo5bobo!
A different extremely smoky puffer (plus a separate simple one) can be seen here:

Code: Select all

x = 16, y = 16, rule = B3-j6i/S23-c4i
o2bo5b3ob2o$b2obob3o3b2obo$2o3bo6b4o$o2b2ob2obo2bobo$ob4o5b2ob2o$3ob2o
b4ob2o$bob2obobobob3o$ob3obobobo2bo$3ob2o4b2o3bo$3o4bo2bob3o$b2obobob
2o5bo$2bob3o2b3obobo$bobobo4b3o$2b2o2bobo2bo3bo$b4o2b3o3bobo$2b2obo2bo
b6o!
A slightly less dirty puffer emerges from this soup after about 8k gens:

Code: Select all

x = 16, y = 16, rule = B3-j6i/S23-c4i
obobob4obo2b2o$2bobo10bo$b3obob4o2bo$obo3b2ob4obo$bo2b3ob5obo$obo5b2ob
5o$bo2bobo3bob2o$2b2obo2b2ob4o$2bo3bo2b3o$b3ob2o5b4o$4b3o4bob2o$3bobo
4bo2bobo$bo4bo3bo4bo$2ob2obo2b7o$2bo2bo3bob5o$o2b2o4b2o2b3o!

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