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Thread For Requesting Help

For discussion of specific patterns or specific families of patterns, both newly-discovered and well-known.

Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby drc » August 9th, 2016, 6:03 pm

BlinkerSpawn wrote:We can already construct an eater3 in 20(21?) gliders. So unless that SL can be made really cheaply (to allow room for components) it won't break new ground.

it's the closest natural still life to the eater 3 one...
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Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby gmc_nxtman » August 9th, 2016, 6:12 pm

drc wrote:
BlinkerSpawn wrote:We can already construct an eater3 in 20(21?) gliders. So unless that SL can be made really cheaply (to allow room for components) it won't break new ground.

it's the closest natural still life to the eater 3 one...


Just because an SL has already occurred in a soup, doesn't mean the recipe is guaranteed to be easier.
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Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby drc » August 10th, 2016, 12:10 am

gmc_nxtman wrote:Just because an SL has already occurred in a soup, doesn't mean the recipe is guaranteed to be easier.

i was just saying... 20 gliders is a lot.
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Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby muzik » September 15th, 2016, 11:24 am

Aside from mirroring it, is there a way to suppress the birth of the red cell?

x = 11, y = 11, rule = LifeHistory
6.A$6.A.A$6.2A4$8.A$8.A.A$2.A5.2A$DA.A$.2A!
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Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby gmc_nxtman » September 15th, 2016, 5:47 pm

muzik wrote:Aside from mirroring it, is there a way to suppress the birth of the red cell?

x = 11, y = 11, rule = LifeHistory
6.A$6.A.A$6.2A4$8.A$8.A.A$2.A5.2A$DA.A$.2A!


x = 12, y = 13, rule = LifeHistory
7.A$7.A.A$7.2A4$9.A$9.A.A$3.A5.2A$2.A.A$3.A$3A$A!
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Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby muzik » September 23rd, 2016, 12:05 pm

Are there any guns of this exact period that can be positioned in such a way to make this possible? (yes I am aware of the existence of vacuum cleaner)

x = 1887, y = 1884, rule = B3/S23
2o$2o6$13bo$12b2o$4b2o6bobo$4bobo$4bo3$19b2o$18b2o$10b3o7bo$10bo$11bo
2$26bo$25b2o$17b2o6bobo$17bobo$17bo3$32b2o$31b2o$23b3o7bo$23bo$24bo2$
39bo$38b2o$30b2o6bobo$30bobo$30bo3$45b2o$44b2o$36b3o7bo$36bo$37bo2$52b
o$51b2o$43b2o6bobo$43bobo$43bo3$58b2o$57b2o$49b3o7bo$49bo$50bo2$65bo$
64b2o$56b2o6bobo$56bobo$56bo3$71b2o$70b2o$62b3o7bo$62bo$63bo2$78bo$77b
2o$69b2o6bobo$69bobo$69bo3$84b2o$83b2o$75b3o7bo$75bo$76bo2$91bo$90b2o$
82b2o6bobo$82bobo$82bo3$97b2o$96b2o$88b3o7bo$88bo$89bo2$104bo$103b2o$
95b2o6bobo$95bobo$95bo3$110b2o$109b2o$101b3o7bo$101bo$102bo2$117bo$
116b2o$108b2o6bobo$108bobo$108bo3$123b2o$122b2o$114b3o7bo$114bo$115bo
2$130bo$129b2o$121b2o6bobo$121bobo$121bo3$136b2o$135b2o$127b3o7bo$127b
o$128bo2$143bo$142b2o$134b2o6bobo$134bobo$134bo3$149b2o$148b2o$140b3o
7bo$140bo$141bo2$156bo$155b2o$147b2o6bobo$147bobo$147bo3$162b2o$161b2o
$153b3o7bo$153bo$154bo2$169bo$168b2o$160b2o6bobo$160bobo$160bo3$175b2o
$174b2o$166b3o7bo$166bo$167bo2$182bo$181b2o$173b2o6bobo$173bobo$173bo
3$188b2o$187b2o$179b3o7bo$179bo$180bo2$195bo$194b2o$186b2o6bobo$186bob
o$186bo3$201b2o$200b2o$192b3o7bo$192bo$193bo2$208bo$207b2o$199b2o6bobo
$199bobo$199bo3$214b2o$213b2o$205b3o7bo$205bo$206bo2$221bo$220b2o$212b
2o6bobo$212bobo$212bo3$227b2o$226b2o$218b3o7bo$218bo$219bo2$234bo$233b
2o$225b2o6bobo$225bobo$225bo3$240b2o$239b2o$231b3o7bo$231bo$232bo2$
247bo$246b2o$238b2o6bobo$238bobo$238bo3$253b2o$252b2o$244b3o7bo$244bo$
245bo2$260bo$259b2o$251b2o6bobo$251bobo$251bo3$266b2o$265b2o$257b3o7bo
$257bo$258bo2$273bo$272b2o$264b2o6bobo$264bobo$264bo3$279b2o$278b2o$
270b3o7bo$270bo$271bo2$286bo$285b2o$277b2o6bobo$277bobo$277bo3$292b2o$
291b2o$283b3o7bo$283bo$284bo2$299bo$298b2o$290b2o6bobo$290bobo$290bo3$
305b2o$304b2o$296b3o7bo$296bo$297bo2$312bo$311b2o$303b2o6bobo$303bobo$
303bo3$318b2o$317b2o$309b3o7bo$309bo$310bo2$325bo$324b2o$316b2o6bobo$
316bobo$316bo3$331b2o$330b2o$322b3o7bo$322bo$323bo2$338bo$337b2o$329b
2o6bobo$329bobo$329bo3$344b2o$343b2o$335b3o7bo$335bo$336bo2$351bo$350b
2o$342b2o6bobo$342bobo$342bo3$357b2o$356b2o$348b3o7bo$348bo$349bo2$
364bo$363b2o$355b2o6bobo$355bobo$355bo3$370b2o$369b2o$361b3o7bo$361bo$
362bo2$377bo$376b2o$368b2o6bobo$368bobo$368bo3$383b2o$382b2o$374b3o7bo
$374bo$375bo2$390bo$389b2o$381b2o6bobo$381bobo$381bo3$396b2o$395b2o$
387b3o7bo$387bo$388bo2$403bo$402b2o$394b2o6bobo$394bobo$394bo3$409b2o$
408b2o$400b3o7bo$400bo$401bo2$416bo$415b2o$407b2o6bobo$407bobo$407bo3$
422b2o$421b2o$413b3o7bo$413bo$414bo2$429bo$428b2o$420b2o6bobo$420bobo$
420bo3$435b2o$434b2o$426b3o7bo$426bo$427bo2$442bo$441b2o$433b2o6bobo$
433bobo$433bo3$448b2o$447b2o$439b3o7bo$439bo$440bo2$455bo$454b2o$446b
2o6bobo$446bobo$446bo3$461b2o$460b2o$452b3o7bo$452bo$453bo2$468bo$467b
2o$459b2o6bobo$459bobo$459bo3$474b2o$473b2o$465b3o7bo$465bo$466bo2$
481bo$480b2o$472b2o6bobo$472bobo$472bo3$487b2o$486b2o$478b3o7bo$478bo$
479bo2$494bo$493b2o$485b2o6bobo$485bobo$485bo3$500b2o$499b2o$491b3o7bo
$491bo$492bo2$507bo$506b2o$498b2o6bobo$498bobo$498bo3$513b2o$512b2o$
504b3o7bo$504bo$505bo2$520bo$519b2o$511b2o6bobo$511bobo$511bo3$526b2o$
525b2o$517b3o7bo$517bo$518bo2$533bo$532b2o$524b2o6bobo$524bobo$524bo3$
539b2o$538b2o$530b3o7bo$530bo$531bo2$546bo$545b2o$537b2o6bobo$537bobo$
537bo3$552b2o$551b2o$543b3o7bo$543bo$544bo2$559bo$558b2o$550b2o6bobo$
550bobo$550bo3$565b2o$564b2o$556b3o7bo$556bo$557bo2$572bo$571b2o$563b
2o6bobo$563bobo$563bo3$578b2o$577b2o$569b3o7bo$569bo$570bo2$585bo$584b
2o$576b2o6bobo$576bobo$576bo3$591b2o$590b2o$582b3o7bo$582bo$583bo2$
598bo$597b2o$589b2o6bobo$589bobo$589bo3$604b2o$603b2o$595b3o7bo$595bo$
596bo2$611bo$610b2o$602b2o6bobo$602bobo$602bo3$617b2o$616b2o$608b3o7bo
$608bo$609bo2$624bo$623b2o$615b2o6bobo$615bobo$615bo3$630b2o$629b2o$
621b3o7bo$621bo$622bo2$637bo$636b2o$628b2o6bobo$628bobo$628bo3$643b2o$
642b2o$634b3o7bo$634bo$635bo2$650bo$649b2o$641b2o6bobo$641bobo$641bo3$
656b2o$655b2o$647b3o7bo$647bo$648bo2$663bo$662b2o$654b2o6bobo$654bobo$
654bo3$669b2o$668b2o$660b3o7bo$660bo$661bo2$676bo$675b2o$667b2o6bobo$
667bobo$667bo3$682b2o$681b2o$673b3o7bo$673bo$674bo2$689bo$688b2o$680b
2o6bobo$680bobo$680bo3$695b2o$694b2o$686b3o7bo$686bo$687bo2$702bo$701b
2o$693b2o6bobo$693bobo$693bo3$708b2o$707b2o$699b3o7bo$699bo$700bo2$
715bo$714b2o$706b2o6bobo$706bobo$706bo3$721b2o$720b2o$712b3o7bo$712bo$
713bo2$728bo$727b2o$719b2o6bobo$719bobo$719bo3$734b2o$733b2o$725b3o7bo
$725bo$726bo2$741bo$740b2o$732b2o6bobo$732bobo$732bo3$747b2o$746b2o$
738b3o7bo$738bo$739bo2$754bo$753b2o$745b2o6bobo$745bobo$745bo3$760b2o$
759b2o$751b3o7bo$751bo$752bo2$767bo$766b2o$758b2o6bobo$758bobo$758bo3$
773b2o$772b2o$764b3o7bo$764bo$765bo2$780bo$779b2o$771b2o6bobo$771bobo$
771bo3$786b2o$785b2o$777b3o7bo$777bo$778bo2$793bo$792b2o$784b2o6bobo$
784bobo$784bo3$799b2o$798b2o$790b3o7bo$790bo$791bo2$806bo$805b2o$797b
2o6bobo$797bobo$797bo3$812b2o$811b2o$803b3o7bo$803bo$804bo2$819bo$818b
2o$810b2o6bobo$810bobo$810bo3$825b2o$824b2o$816b3o7bo$816bo$817bo2$
832bo$831b2o$823b2o6bobo$823bobo$823bo3$838b2o$837b2o$829b3o7bo$829bo$
830bo2$845bo$844b2o$836b2o6bobo$836bobo$836bo3$851b2o$850b2o$842b3o7bo
$842bo$843bo2$858bo$857b2o$849b2o6bobo$849bobo$849bo3$864b2o$863b2o$
855b3o7bo$855bo$856bo2$871bo$870b2o$862b2o6bobo$862bobo$862bo3$877b2o$
876b2o$868b3o7bo$868bo$869bo2$884bo$883b2o$875b2o6bobo$875bobo$875bo3$
890b2o$889b2o$881b3o7bo$881bo$882bo2$897bo$896b2o$888b2o6bobo$888bobo$
888bo3$903b2o$902b2o$894b3o7bo$894bo$895bo2$910bo$909b2o$901b2o6bobo$
901bobo$901bo3$916b2o$915b2o$907b3o7bo$907bo$908bo2$923bo$922b2o$914b
2o6bobo$914bobo$914bo3$929b2o$928b2o$920b3o7bo$920bo$921bo2$936bo$935b
2o$927b2o6bobo$927bobo$927bo3$942b2o$941b2o$933b3o7bo$933bo$934bo2$
949bo$948b2o$940b2o6bobo$940bobo$940bo3$955b2o$954b2o$946b3o7bo$946bo$
947bo2$962bo$961b2o$953b2o6bobo$953bobo$953bo3$968b2o$967b2o$959b3o7bo
$959bo$960bo2$975bo$974b2o$966b2o6bobo$966bobo$966bo3$981b2o$980b2o$
972b3o7bo$972bo$973bo2$988bo$987b2o$979b2o6bobo$979bobo$979bo3$994b2o$
993b2o$985b3o7bo$985bo$986bo2$1001bo$1000b2o$992b2o6bobo$992bobo$992bo
3$1007b2o$1006b2o$998b3o7bo$998bo$999bo2$1014bo$1013b2o$1005b2o6bobo$
1005bobo$1005bo3$1020b2o$1019b2o$1011b3o7bo$1011bo$1012bo2$1027bo$
1026b2o$1018b2o6bobo$1018bobo$1018bo3$1033b2o$1032b2o$1024b3o7bo$1024b
o$1025bo2$1040bo$1039b2o$1031b2o6bobo$1031bobo$1031bo3$1046b2o$1045b2o
$1037b3o7bo$1037bo$1038bo2$1053bo$1052b2o$1044b2o6bobo$1044bobo$1044bo
3$1059b2o$1058b2o$1050b3o7bo$1050bo$1051bo2$1066bo$1065b2o$1057b2o6bob
o$1057bobo$1057bo3$1072b2o$1071b2o$1063b3o7bo$1063bo$1064bo2$1079bo$
1078b2o$1070b2o6bobo$1070bobo$1070bo3$1085b2o$1084b2o$1076b3o7bo$1076b
o$1077bo2$1092bo$1091b2o$1083b2o6bobo$1083bobo$1083bo3$1098b2o$1097b2o
$1089b3o7bo$1089bo$1090bo2$1105bo$1104b2o$1096b2o6bobo$1096bobo$1096bo
3$1111b2o$1110b2o$1102b3o7bo$1102bo$1103bo2$1118bo$1117b2o$1109b2o6bob
o$1109bobo$1109bo3$1124b2o$1123b2o$1115b3o7bo$1115bo$1116bo2$1131bo$
1130b2o$1122b2o6bobo$1122bobo$1122bo3$1137b2o$1136b2o$1128b3o7bo$1128b
o$1129bo2$1144bo$1143b2o$1135b2o6bobo$1135bobo$1135bo3$1150b2o$1149b2o
$1141b3o7bo$1141bo$1142bo2$1157bo$1156b2o$1148b2o6bobo$1148bobo$1148bo
3$1163b2o$1162b2o$1154b3o7bo$1154bo$1155bo2$1170bo$1169b2o$1161b2o6bob
o$1161bobo$1161bo3$1176b2o$1175b2o$1167b3o7bo$1167bo$1168bo2$1183bo$
1182b2o$1174b2o6bobo$1174bobo$1174bo3$1189b2o$1188b2o$1180b3o7bo$1180b
o$1181bo2$1196bo$1195b2o$1187b2o6bobo$1187bobo$1187bo3$1202b2o$1201b2o
$1193b3o7bo$1193bo$1194bo2$1209bo$1208b2o$1200b2o6bobo$1200bobo$1200bo
3$1215b2o$1214b2o$1206b3o7bo$1206bo$1207bo2$1222bo$1221b2o$1213b2o6bob
o$1213bobo$1213bo3$1228b2o$1227b2o$1219b3o7bo$1219bo$1220bo2$1235bo$
1234b2o$1226b2o6bobo$1226bobo$1226bo3$1241b2o$1240b2o$1232b3o7bo$1232b
o$1233bo2$1248bo$1247b2o$1239b2o6bobo$1239bobo$1239bo3$1254b2o$1253b2o
$1245b3o7bo$1245bo$1246bo2$1261bo$1260b2o$1252b2o6bobo$1252bobo$1252bo
3$1267b2o$1266b2o$1258b3o7bo$1258bo$1259bo2$1274bo$1273b2o$1265b2o6bob
o$1265bobo$1265bo3$1280b2o$1279b2o$1271b3o7bo$1271bo$1272bo2$1287bo$
1286b2o$1278b2o6bobo$1278bobo$1278bo3$1293b2o$1292b2o$1284b3o7bo$1284b
o$1285bo2$1300bo$1299b2o$1291b2o6bobo$1291bobo$1291bo3$1306b2o$1305b2o
$1297b3o7bo$1297bo$1298bo2$1313bo$1312b2o$1304b2o6bobo$1304bobo$1304bo
3$1319b2o$1318b2o$1310b3o7bo$1310bo$1311bo2$1326bo$1325b2o$1317b2o6bob
o$1317bobo$1317bo3$1332b2o$1331b2o$1323b3o7bo$1323bo$1324bo2$1339bo$
1338b2o$1330b2o6bobo$1330bobo$1330bo3$1345b2o$1344b2o$1336b3o7bo$1336b
o$1337bo2$1352bo$1351b2o$1343b2o6bobo$1343bobo$1343bo3$1358b2o$1357b2o
$1349b3o7bo$1349bo$1350bo2$1365bo$1364b2o$1356b2o6bobo$1356bobo$1356bo
3$1371b2o$1370b2o$1362b3o7bo$1362bo$1363bo2$1378bo$1377b2o$1369b2o6bob
o$1369bobo$1369bo3$1384b2o$1383b2o$1375b3o7bo$1375bo$1376bo2$1391bo$
1390b2o$1382b2o6bobo$1382bobo$1382bo3$1397b2o$1396b2o$1388b3o7bo$1388b
o$1389bo2$1404bo$1403b2o$1395b2o6bobo$1395bobo$1395bo3$1410b2o$1409b2o
$1401b3o7bo$1401bo$1402bo2$1417bo$1416b2o$1408b2o6bobo$1408bobo$1408bo
3$1423b2o$1422b2o$1414b3o7bo$1414bo$1415bo2$1430bo$1429b2o$1421b2o6bob
o$1421bobo$1421bo3$1436b2o$1435b2o$1427b3o7bo$1427bo$1428bo2$1443bo$
1442b2o$1434b2o6bobo$1434bobo$1434bo3$1449b2o$1448b2o$1440b3o7bo$1440b
o$1441bo2$1456bo$1455b2o$1447b2o6bobo$1447bobo$1447bo3$1462b2o$1461b2o
$1453b3o7bo$1453bo$1454bo2$1469bo$1468b2o$1460b2o6bobo$1460bobo$1460bo
3$1475b2o$1474b2o$1466b3o7bo$1466bo$1467bo2$1482bo$1481b2o$1473b2o6bob
o$1473bobo$1473bo3$1488b2o$1487b2o$1479b3o7bo$1479bo$1480bo2$1495bo$
1494b2o$1486b2o6bobo$1486bobo$1486bo3$1501b2o$1500b2o$1492b3o7bo$1492b
o$1493bo2$1508bo$1507b2o$1499b2o6bobo$1499bobo$1499bo3$1514b2o$1513b2o
$1505b3o7bo$1505bo$1506bo2$1521bo$1520b2o$1512b2o6bobo$1512bobo$1512bo
3$1527b2o$1526b2o$1518b3o7bo$1518bo$1519bo2$1534bo$1533b2o$1525b2o6bob
o$1525bobo$1525bo3$1540b2o$1539b2o$1531b3o7bo$1531bo$1532bo2$1547bo$
1546b2o$1538b2o6bobo$1538bobo$1538bo3$1553b2o$1552b2o$1544b3o7bo$1544b
o$1545bo2$1560bo$1559b2o$1551b2o6bobo$1551bobo$1551bo3$1566b2o$1565b2o
$1557b3o7bo$1557bo$1558bo2$1573bo$1572b2o$1564b2o6bobo$1564bobo$1564bo
3$1579b2o$1578b2o$1570b3o7bo$1570bo$1571bo2$1586bo$1585b2o$1577b2o6bob
o$1577bobo$1577bo3$1592b2o$1591b2o$1583b3o7bo$1583bo$1584bo2$1599bo$
1598b2o$1590b2o6bobo$1590bobo$1590bo3$1605b2o$1604b2o$1596b3o7bo$1596b
o$1597bo2$1612bo$1611b2o$1603b2o6bobo$1603bobo$1603bo3$1618b2o$1617b2o
$1609b3o7bo$1609bo$1610bo2$1625bo$1624b2o$1616b2o6bobo$1616bobo$1616bo
3$1631b2o$1630b2o$1622b3o7bo$1622bo$1623bo2$1638bo$1637b2o$1629b2o6bob
o$1629bobo$1629bo3$1644b2o$1643b2o$1635b3o7bo$1635bo$1636bo2$1651bo$
1650b2o$1642b2o6bobo$1642bobo$1642bo3$1657b2o$1656b2o$1648b3o7bo$1648b
o$1649bo2$1664bo$1663b2o$1655b2o6bobo$1655bobo$1655bo3$1670b2o$1669b2o
$1661b3o7bo$1661bo$1662bo2$1677bo$1676b2o$1668b2o6bobo$1668bobo$1668bo
3$1683b2o$1682b2o$1674b3o7bo$1674bo$1675bo2$1690bo$1689b2o$1681b2o6bob
o$1681bobo$1681bo3$1696b2o$1695b2o$1687b3o7bo$1687bo$1688bo2$1703bo$
1702b2o$1694b2o6bobo$1694bobo$1694bo3$1709b2o$1708b2o$1700b3o7bo$1700b
o$1701bo2$1716bo$1715b2o$1707b2o6bobo$1707bobo$1707bo3$1722b2o$1721b2o
$1713b3o7bo$1713bo$1714bo2$1729bo$1728b2o$1720b2o6bobo$1720bobo$1720bo
3$1735b2o$1734b2o$1726b3o7bo$1726bo$1727bo2$1742bo$1741b2o$1733b2o6bob
o$1733bobo$1733bo3$1748b2o$1747b2o$1739b3o7bo$1739bo$1740bo2$1755bo$
1754b2o$1746b2o6bobo$1746bobo$1746bo3$1761b2o$1760b2o$1752b3o7bo$1752b
o$1753bo2$1768bo$1767b2o$1759b2o6bobo$1759bobo$1759bo3$1774b2o$1773b2o
$1765b3o7bo$1765bo$1766bo2$1781bo$1780b2o$1772b2o6bobo$1772bobo$1772bo
3$1787b2o$1786b2o$1778b3o7bo$1778bo$1779bo2$1794bo$1793b2o$1785b2o6bob
o$1785bobo$1785bo3$1800b2o$1799b2o$1791b3o7bo$1791bo$1792bo2$1807bo$
1806b2o$1798b2o6bobo$1798bobo$1798bo3$1813b2o$1812b2o$1804b3o7bo$1804b
o$1805bo2$1820bo$1819b2o$1811b2o6bobo$1811bobo$1811bo3$1826b2o$1825b2o
$1817b3o7bo$1817bo$1818bo2$1833bo$1832b2o$1824b2o6bobo$1824bobo$1824bo
3$1839b2o$1838b2o$1830b3o7bo$1830bo$1831bo2$1846bo$1845b2o$1837b2o6bob
o$1837bobo$1837bo3$1852b2o$1851b2o$1843b3o7bo$1843bo$1844bo2$1859bo$
1858b2o$1850b2o6bobo$1850bobo$1850bo3$1865b2o$1864b2o$1856b3o7bo$1856b
o$1857bo2$1872bo$1871b2o$1863b2o6bobo$1863bobo$1863bo3$1878b2o$1877b2o
$1869b3o7bo$1869bo$1870bo2$1885bo$1884b2o$1876b2o6bobo$1876bobo$1876bo
!
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Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby dvgrn » September 23rd, 2016, 1:56 pm

muzik wrote:Are there any guns of this exact period that can be positioned in such a way to make this possible? (yes I am aware of the existence of vacuum cleaner)...

There's generally a way, if you want something badly enough. Check the pseudo p26 glider gun for some ideas to start out. You can't reflect p26 glider streams terribly easily, but you can build LWSS guns down to p26 easily enough. So you do that, and then figure out how to collide an LWSS with a glider to make a different-direction glider edge shooter, that you can line up next to another p26 gun.

Of course, then you have to worry about what happens when the block you're pulling gets down to the insertion point for the second glider. Or maybe that's the fun part...?
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Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby muzik » September 23rd, 2016, 2:03 pm

dvgrn wrote:Of course, then you have to worry about what happens when the block you're pulling gets down to the insertion point for the second glider. Or maybe that's the fun part...?

ExtendedLife killer cells. Cheatish, but I'm wanting to see if the same combination of gliders will pull anything else.
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Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby chris_c » September 23rd, 2016, 5:35 pm

muzik wrote:Are there any guns of this exact period that can be positioned in such a way to make this possible? (yes I am aware of the existence of vacuum cleaner)


Here is an edge shooting p78 gun that gives you two-thirds of the necessary gliders:

x = 217, y = 172, rule = B3/S23
106b2o$3o103b2o$o$bo$87bo$85b3o16bo$84bo18bo3bo$7b2o74bobo17b2o$7bobo
73bobo14b3o2bo2bo3b3o$7bo76bo15bo2b3o4bo3b2o$100bo6bo2bobo2b2o4b2o$
101b2o2b2o2bo5bo5b2o$81bo21b2o5bo2b2o$80b3o27bo$68b2o9b5o$68b2o8bo5bo$
77b2o5b2o$76b2o7b2o$77bobo3bobo35b2o$78b2o3b2o3b2o26b2o2bo2bo$20b2o66b
obo25bobo2b2o$20bobo67bo10b2o16b2o$20bo69b2o10bo17bo$99b3o15bo2bob2o$
99bo16bobob2obo$71bob2o42bobo$69b3ob2o43bo2b2o$26b3o39bo50b2ob3o$26bo
42b3ob2o50bo$27bo43b2o2bo43b2ob3o$74bobo6bo28bo6b2obo$70bob2obobo4bobo
26bobo$70b2obo2bo7bo8b2o15b2obo$73bo6b2o3bo7bo8b2o8bo$73b2o5b2o2bo6bob
o9bo$71b2o2bobo6bo6b2o10bobo8b2o$70bo2bo2b2o26b2o8b2o$71b2o7b2o2b2o$
80b6o$82bo$39b3o82b2o32b2o$39bo65b2o17b2o32b2o$40bo65b2o$105bo$139bo$
137b3o16b2o$46b2o61bo26bo19b4o$46bobo41b2o16bobo24bobo18bo2bo$46bo27b
2o14b2o16bobo24bobo15b2o4b2o3b2o$75bo33bo26bo15b2o3b3o3bo2b2o$72b3o31b
3o44b2ob2obo2b3o2bo5b2o$72bo33bo47b4o4bo4bo5b2o$162b5o$132b3o28b2o$
120b2o9bo3bo$89bo30b2o8bo5bo$78bo9bo40bo3bo3bo$78b3o6b3obo37bo7bo$81bo
5b2o2b2o36bobo3bobo35b2o$59b2o19b2o5b2o2b2o37b2o3b2o3b2o26b2o2bo2bo$
59bobo78bobo25bobo2b2o$59bo27b2o53bo10b2o16b2o$87bo4bo49b2o10bo17bo$
87bo4bo58b3o15bo2bob2o$88bobo60bo16bobob2obo$123bob2o42bobo$65b3o53b3o
b2o43bo2b2o$65bo54bo50b2ob3o$66bo54b3ob2o50bo$100b2o21b2o2bo43b2ob3o$
100b2o24bobo42b2obo$79bo42bob2obobo4b3o26b3o$76bo2bo42b2obo2bo5b3o8b2o
16bobo$79bo45bo6b2o11bo8b2o7bo$75bo2bo46b2o5bo2b3o5bobo9bo$76bo46b2o2b
obo13b2o10bobo8bo$122bo2bo2b2o2bo23b2o8b2o$123b2o7bo3b2o$133bo2bo$78b
3o52bobo$78bo97b2o$79bo77b2o17b2o$156bobo$158bo3$99bo61bo$98b2o42b2o
16bobo$98bobo25b2o14b2o16bobo$127bo33bo$124b3o31b3o$124bo33bo38b2o$
197b2o3$141bo36bo$130bo9bobo33b3o16bo$130b3o7bo34bo18bo3bo$98b2o33bo5b
o3b2o29bobo17b2o$98bobo31b2o6bo2b2o29bobo14b3o2bo2bo3b3o$98bo41bo34bo
15bo2b3o4bo3b2o$191bo6bo2bobo2b2o4b2o$139b2o2b2o47b2o2b2o2bo5bo5b2o$
139b6o27bo21b2o5bo2b2o$142bo28b3o27bo$159b2o9b5o$118b2o39b2o8bo5bo$
117b2o9bo39b2o5b2o$119bo8b2o37b2o7b2o$129b2o8b2o11b2o14bobo3bobo35b2o$
125b3o10bob2o10b2o15b2o3b2o3b2o26b2o2bo2bo$124bo13bob2o37bobo25bobo2b
2o$126b3o2b3o3b2ob2o39bo10b2o16b2o$128b2ob2o4b4o40b2o10bo17bo$127b2obo
b3ob4o50b3o15bo2bob2o$125b3o2b2o2b4o52bo16bobob2obo$125b2o8b2o25bob2o
42bobo$160b3ob2o43bo2b2o$117b3o39bo50b2ob3o$117bo19b2o21b3ob2o50bo$
118bo18b2o23b2o2bo43b2ob3o$165bobo6bo28bo6b2obo$161bob2obobo4bobo26bob
o$161b2obo2bo7bo8b2o15b2obo$164bo6b2o3bo7bo8b2o8bo$164b2o5b2o2bo6bobo
9bo$162b2o2bobo6bo6b2o10bobo8b2o$161bo2bo2b2o26b2o8b2o$162b2o7b2o2b2o$
171b6o$173bo$215b2o$196b2o17b2o$197b2o$196bo3$137b2o61bo$137bobo41b2o
16bobo$137bo27b2o14b2o16bobo$166bo33bo$163b3o31b3o$163bo33bo4$180bo$
169bo9bo$169b3o6b3obo$172bo5b2o2b2o$171b2o5b2o2b2o2$178b2o$178bo4bo$
178bo4bo$179bobo2$156b3o$156bo10b2o$157bo9bobo$165b2ob2o8b3o10b2o$164b
2o11bo13b2o$167bo3bo5bo3bo$166b5obo$165bo7bo6bo$173bo5bo$164bo2b5o$
164bobo6bo2bo3$176b2o$176b2o!


Here is a p78 LWSS gun:

x = 113, y = 99, rule = B3/S23
93b2o$93b2o3$74bo$72b3o14b3o$71bo15bo3b2o$70bobo16bobo$70bobo12b4o2b2o
5bo4b2o$71bo12b2o5b2o2bob3o3bobo$85bobo3b2o2b2o4bo3bo2b2o$86b2o7b5o4b
2o2b2o$67b3o26bo2bo$68bo32bo$55b2o$55b2o5b3o7bo$17b2o42bobo3b3o$17b2o
42bo$61b2ob2o5bo36b2o$63bo3bobo5b2o26b2o2bo2bo$63b3o9bobo25bobo2b2o$
10b2o65bo10b2o16b2o$10b2o65b2o10bo17bo$86b3o15bo2bob2o$86bo16bobob2obo
$58bob2o42bobo$21b3o32b3ob2o43bo2b2o$21bobo31bo50b2ob3o$20bo2bo32b3ob
2o50bo$20b3o35b2o2bo43b2ob3o$20b3o38bobo33b3o6b2obo$21bo2bo32bob2obobo
4bo27bo2bo$21bo35b2obo2bo7bo8b2o14bo3bo$4bo19bo13bo21bo10bo8bo8b2o6bo
2bo$4b3o31b3o19b2o10b2o4bobo9bo6bob2o$7bo14bo18bo16b2o2bobo6bobo4b2o
10bobo7b3o$6b2o15bo9bo6bobo14bo2bo2b2o7b3o16b2o8b2o$22b2o10bo5bobo15b
2o14bo$32b3o6bo30b2o$72b2o$93b3o15b2o$95bo15b2o$51bo42bo$50bo5b2o$53bo
3bo2$44b2obo3bobo42bo$3b2o40b2o30b2o16bobo$2bo2bo2b2o26b2o12bo10b2o14b
2o16bobo$3b2o2bobo13b2o10bobo11bobo10bo33bo$5b2o16bobo9bo11bob2o8b3o
31b3o$5bo8bo10bo8b2o11b3o9bo33bo$2b2obo2bo4b3o9b2o21bo$2bob2obobo3bo2b
o$6bobo6b2o34b2obo$3b2o2bo7bo35b2ob3o$b3ob2o5b2o43bo$o11b4o35b2ob3o8b
2o9bo$b3ob2o6bo2bo33bo2b2o11bo8bo$3bob2o7bo34bobo14bobo4bobo$31bo11b3o
2bobob2obo11b2o6bo$13bobo15b3o11bo3bo2bob2o16bobo$13b2o7b2o10bo9bo7bo
19bo$22bo10b2o16b2o19bobo$20bobo25bobo2b2o18b2o$14b2o4b2o14b2o10b2o2bo
2bo$13b2o20b2o2b2o12b2o$15bo19bob4o$35b3o$2o33b2o2b2o13b2o$2o34b3o2bo
12bo$36b2o2b3o9bobo$38bo2bo10b2o14b2o$38b3o18b2o7b2o14b2o$39bo20bo23bo
$16bo43bobo22b3o$15bobo43b2o24bo$15bobo$16bo$17b3o$19bo$81bo$79b3o$38b
2o30b3o5bo$38b2o30b2o6b2o$71bobo$59bobo11bo$60b2o12b2o$60bo11bobo$72b
2o3$4bo2bo$3bo38b4o$3bo3bo34bo3bo$3b4o35bo$43bo2bo$73b2o$73b2o!


Can you find a method that uses these to insert the missing glider?
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Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby muzik » October 7th, 2016, 9:34 am

Are there any stable eater mechanisms that can eat single sparks like as shown?

*...
..**
..**
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Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby dvgrn » October 7th, 2016, 9:51 am

muzik wrote:Are there any stable eater mechanisms that can eat single sparks like as shown?

*...
..**
..**

Do you mean the one-bit spark in the corner -- i.e., you want something to replace the block with, that can recover with no damage?

Empty space seems like a good candidate, in that case. But I take it that you want something to react, and then recover. How fast does it have to recover?

E.g., if blocking off the glider inputs in Guam's spark-to-2-glider converter doesn't count as a solution, why not exactly?
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Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby muzik » October 7th, 2016, 10:13 am

Well, not strictly the spark, but a bunch of other such reactions that cause the block to die in the same way.

Such as this:

.**...
.**...
......
...*..
.*...*
*.....
*....*
*****.


Yes of course I could leave it empty, but what if I needed the block (or a similar contraption) there for another purpose?
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Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby dvgrn » October 7th, 2016, 10:31 am

muzik wrote:Yes of course I could leave it empty, but what if I needed the block (or a similar contraption) there for another purpose?

Then it would be important to know what the other purpose was. You might well be better off building the whatever-it-is after the spark goes by, and deleting it again when you don't need it.

Basically, the odds don't seem good that whatever Bellman-ish sparkeater you come up with, will also just happen to have some other completely unrelated use. Specific problems you can look at and come up with a solution for, but if a sparkeater is basically just taking up space and recovering after being sparked, then the odds are that it's just going to get in the way.

----------------------------------------------------

Now, a sparkeater could suddenly turn into one of Life's Holy Grails, if it's something along the lines of Dean Hickerson's long-recovery-time eaters, and it manages to produce a new accessible one-bit spark (or two or more of them, even better) on the other side of the still life, far away from the input spark. If multiple copies of something like this could be connected up to form a variable-length closed loop, then we'd very likely have solved the omniperiodicity problem.

Might be interesting to write a script to exhaustively enumerate small Spartan constellations, add one-bit sparks to them, and see if the original constellation ever happens to come back. I don't think that search has ever quite been done before. Mind you, it would probably take a long long search before the first candidate result came back -- and probably the first 10^N results would be false positives that couldn't actually be used for some frustrating reason or another...!
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Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby BlinkerSpawn » October 18th, 2016, 8:45 pm

What's the cheapest reasonable way to make this block predecessor from the S/SW?
x = 5, y = 2, rule = B3/S23
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Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby gmc_nxtman » June 9th, 2017, 6:30 pm

Is there any smaller way to make a stable boat-bit memory unit? Preferably, a reduction of the topmost (and largest) circuit, which is basically a merge circuit/reflector that returns a glider on the exact same lane.

#C Add red glider to change state
x = 280, y = 88, rule = LifeHistory
179.A11.2A$178.A.A9.B2AB$170.A3.2A2.A.A9.3B$169.A.A2.A2.2A.2A9.B.B$
169.A.A3.A.A2.B8.5B$170.A.4A2.AB2A6.6B$172.A3.A.A.2A4.8B$154.2A15.A2.
BA.A2.13B$155.A14.A.2BA.A5.13B$155.A.AB11.2A.2BA5.15B$124.3D.4D.5D18.
2AB.2A12.3B4.15B$123.D4.D6.D22.2B2AB12.2B.B.17B$123.D4.D6.D22.4B6.29B
$124.2D2.3D4.D22.6B3.16B2A13B$126.D.D6.D23.6B2.16B2A14B$126.D.D6.D23.
7B.27B3.B2A$123.3D2.4D3.D22.35B4.A2.A$157.20B2.2B2.B3.6B5.2A.A$141.D.
D12.18B14.6B7.A$139.D5.D10.16B14.9B6.2A$157.14B15.2A4.4B$138.D2.DB3.D
9.16B15.A5.4B$141.B2D10.2AB.14B12.3A7.4B$138.D2.2D2B.D6.A.AB.12B.B2A
10.A10.4B$142.4B7.A4.8B5.BA.A21.4B$139.D3.2BDB5.2A4.7B9.A22.4B$141.D.
D4B9.8B9.2A22.4B$145.4B8.8B34.4B$146.4B5.11B34.4B$147.4B.14B35.4B$
148.17B2A35.4B$149.16B2A36.4B$150.18B36.4B$151.16B38.4B$152.14B40.4B$
151.15B41.4B$150.16B42.4B$146.20B43.4B$144.23B43.4B44.4B$141.2B.23B
44.4B42.4B$140.2A24B5.2A39.4B40.4B$140.2A24B5.A41.4B38.4B$141.2B.21B
3.BA.A42.4B36.4B$144.22B2.B2A29.A11.2B.4B34.4B$143.26B31.3A6.11B32.4B
$142.28B33.A4.3B2A8B30.4B$140.30B20.2A10.2A4.3B2A9B16.2A10.4B$139.31B
21.A10.5B2.14B16.A9.4B$139.31B21.A.AB9.4B2.14B13.A10.4B$137.2AB.2A17B
5.B.4B10.A10.2AB.3B4.22B12.5A5.4B5.2A$136.A.AB.ABA4B3.7B10.4B7.3A12.
7B.24B16.A4.4B5.A$136.A5.AB8.6B11.4B5.A15.33B12.3AB2.7B.BA.A$135.2A
15.7BA10.4B4.2A15.33B10.A.2B3.7B.B2A$152.4B2.A.A2.2A6.9B14.35B9.4A12B
$154.B4.2A3.A7.6B14.38B6.2A2.BA3B2A7B$164.A.2A5.6B3.B2.2B2.25B.16B4.A
2.3AB.2B2A7B$165.A2.A4.33B2.6B2.2B.8B.4B3.2A.A.B3.10B$166.2AB3.27B.6B
4.3B6.7B3.4B5.A8.8B$167.14B2A16B2.B.5B13.4B5.4B4.2A7.9B$168.13B2A16B
7.2A14.4B5.4B13.3B2.4B$169.29B8.A13.A.A.A.A5.4B10.5B3.4B$169.17B.B.2B
16.3A9.A.2A.2A.A5.4B9.2A7.4B$170.15B4.3B17.A9.A3.A3.A6.4B9.A8.4B$170.
15B5.A2B.2A22.2A3.A.2A8.4B5.3A10.4B$171.13B5.A.A2B.A28.A11.4B4.A13.4B
$3D2.4D2.2D2.3D155.13B2.A.AB2.A27.A.A12.4B18.4B$D2.D.D4.D2.D.D2.D153.
8B4.2A.A.A3.A28.2A14.4B18.4B$D2.D.D4.D2.D.D2.D153.6B6.2ABA2.4A.A43.4B
5.A12.4B$3D2.3D2.4D.D2.D153.5B8.B2.A.A3.A.A43.4B4.3A11.4B$D2.D.D4.D2.
D.D2.D153.B.B9.2A.2A2.A2.A.A44.4B6.A11.4B$D2.D.D4.D2.D.D2.D154.3B9.A.
A2.2A3.A46.4B4.2A12.4B$D2.D.4D.D2.D.3D154.B2AB9.A.A55.4B3.5B10.4B$
173.2A11.A57.4B4.4B10.4B$245.4B.6B11.4B$5.D.D238.10B12.4B$2.BDB.B.BDB
.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.
B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B
.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.
B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.11B.B.B.B.B.B.5B$B.D7BD264B$2.2B5C267B.B$
BDBC4BC2BD265B2A$.7BC268B2A$.DBC3BC3BD243BA19B2.B$3.B.C.B.B.B.B.B.B.B
.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.
B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B
.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.
B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.B.3BABAB.B.B.B.B.B.B.B2.2B$2.D7.D243.B2A16.B2A$
3.D5.D245.B18.A.A$5.D.D247.2A15.A.A.3A$256.A15.2A5.A$253.3A22.2A$253.
A!
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Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby dvgrn » June 9th, 2017, 7:13 pm

gmc_nxtman wrote:Is there any smaller way to make a stable boat-bit memory unit? Preferably, a reduction of the topmost (and largest) circuit, which is basically a merge circuit/reflector that returns a glider on the exact same lane.

Does it have to be an input MWSS, and an output glider? Here's the smallest known P1 mechanism I can think of under those conditions, but there's probably something smaller along similar lines. I don't know if the geometry works, but you can cap off the glider output and attach more Herschel conduits on the right side if you prefer.

x = 125, y = 67, rule = LifeHistory
2A$A.A4.2A$2.A3.B2AB$2.2A3.2B$4.AB.3B$2.3A6B$.A2.B.5B$.2A3.6B$5.8B55.
5D2.2D3.3D2.3D.D4.4D$6.8B56.D3.D2.D.D4.D4.D4.D$5.10B55.D3.D2.D.D4.D4.
D4.D$6.10B54.D3.D2.D.D4.D4.D4.3D$5.6B2.4B53.D3.D2.D.D.2D.D.2D.D4.D$6.
6B2.3B53.D3.D2.D.D2.D.D2.D.D4.D$5.6B4.2B53.D4.2D3.3D2.3D.4D.4D$6.2BDB
DB4.B.3D2.4D2.2D2.3D$5.BD4B.D5.D2.D.D4.D2.D.D2.D47.D.D$5.D6B.D4.D2.D.
D4.D2.D.D2.D45.D5.D$5.2B3CB7.3D2.3D2.4D.D2.D$4.D.BC2BCB2.D3.D2.D.D4.D
2.D.D2.D44.D2.CB3.D$5.2BC3B7.D2.D.D4.D2.D.D2.D46.2B2C$4.D.BC3BC2.D3.D
2.D.4D.D2.D.3D45.D2.2C2B.D9.A$5.2BC3B74.4B8.3A$5.D2BCBCB.D59.A8.D3.2B
DB6.A$5.BD4B.D17.D.D40.3A8.D.D4B5.2A$8.DBD17.D5.D41.A11.4B2.4B$6.B.B
66.2A12.7B$27.D2.CB3.D39.4B11.7B$30.B2C23.A20.3B11.6B$27.D2.2C2B.D20.
3A12.B.3B.4B11.6B$31.4B24.A10.18B2.8B$28.D3.2BDB10.A11.2A3.B5.2B2A26B
$30.D.D4B7.3A11.8B3.2B2A26B$43.A16.8B.20B.10B$35.4B4.2A15.41B17.A$28.
2A6.9B14.15B.2B2.23B7.5B3.A.A$29.A7.6B14.17B8.21B4.7B3.A.A.D$29.A.2A
5.6B3.B2.2B2.19B11.15B.14B4.A3.D$30.A2.A4.35B12.22BD6B9.D$31.2AB3.27B
.7B13.8B.13BDBD4B3.D.D.D2.D$32.14B2A25B10.8B3.2B2A9B3D4B9.D$33.13B2A
26B9.2A3.B5.2B2A11BD4B8.D$34.29B2.8B11.A10.18B8.D$34.17B.B.2B11.6B8.
3A12.B.3B.7BDB$35.15B4.3B10.5B9.A19.4B.2BDBD$35.15B5.A2B.2A7.4B28.4B
4.B2D$36.13B5.A.A2B.A7.3B28.4B6.B$38.13B2.A.AB2.A9.4B25.4B7.2A$37.8B
4.2A.A.A3.A12.2A24.4B9.A$37.6B6.2ABA2.4A.A10.A24.4B9.A$37.5B8.B2.A.A
3.A.A10.3A20.4B10.2A$37.B.B9.2A.2A2.A2.A.A12.A19.4B$38.3B9.A.A2.2A3.A
32.4B$37.B2AB9.A.A39.4B$38.2A11.A39.4B$90.4B$89.4B$88.4B$87.4B2$80.2D
2.D2.D.5D$79.D2.D.D2.D3.D$79.D2.D.D2.D3.D$79.D2.D.D2.D3.D$79.D2.D.D2.
D3.D$79.D2.D.D2.D3.D$80.2D3.2D4.D!
#C [[ STEP 5 STOP 503 ]]

I labeled the boat-bit input TOGGLE rather than SET, but it really does the same thing as your SET input -- send in two signals in a row and the bit ends up turned off again.

If the MWSS absolutely has to be what reads the boat-bit, there's probably a solution with a marginally smaller bounding box -- the circuit that drops the glider back on the return lane doesn't actually have to be an edge shooter, it could just be any transparent glider output. But I'm kind of hoping that's not really one of the requirements...?
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Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby gmc_nxtman » June 9th, 2017, 8:46 pm

dvgrn wrote:Does it have to be an input MWSS, and an output glider?


Not necessarily; the MWSS input was simply the smallest reading mechanism I knew of, and the MWSS->glider converter at the end was simply for practicality.

dvgrn wrote:Here's the smallest known P1 mechanism I can think of under those conditions, but there's probably something smaller along similar lines...
...


I was originally thinking of something like this with herschel stoppers, but I couldn't find a mechanism where the bit is unaffected after being read - unless a conduit-like reaction could be found, where something emitted a passing spark, that could be converted into a glider to a catalytic boat, then my best read mechanism relies on temporarily destroying the boat. In this instance, the boat is destroyed permanently after being read, which isn't quite what I need.

dvgrn wrote:...the circuit that drops the glider back on the return lane doesn't actually have to be an edge shooter, it could just be any transparent glider output. But I'm kind of hoping that's not really one of the requirements...?


That isn't one of the requirements, but it is the smallest merge circuit I could find that served the aforementioned purpose of allowing an external toggle and read from the same glider lane.
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Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby dvgrn » June 9th, 2017, 10:04 pm

gmc_nxtman wrote:I was originally thinking of something like this with herschel stoppers, but I couldn't find a mechanism where the bit is unaffected after being read - unless a conduit-like reaction could be found, where something emitted a passing spark, that could be converted into a glider to a catalytic boat, then my best read mechanism relies on temporarily destroying the boat. In this instance, the boat is destroyed permanently after being read, which isn't quite what I need.

Ah, right. Is the toggle SET/RESET a requirement? And does the mechanism have to have a boat-bit in it, or could it be some other structure?

EDIT: The extra Herschel output allows a possible fix -- or a whole lot of them, this is just a first random choice of connections:

x = 151, y = 79, rule = LifeHistory
48.5D2.2D3.3D2.3D.D4.4D$50.D3.D2.D.D4.D4.D4.D$50.D3.D2.D.D4.D4.D4.D$
50.D3.D2.D.D4.D4.D4.3D$50.D3.D2.D.D.2D.D.2D.D4.D34.A11.2A$50.D3.D2.D.
D2.D.D2.D.D4.D33.A.A9.B2AB$50.D4.2D3.3D2.3D.4D.4D18.D3.A3.2A2.A.A9.3B
$91.2A.3D2.A.A2.A2.2A.2A9.B.B$64.D.D23.B2ADB4.A.A3.A.A2.B8.5B$62.D5.D
22.2B2D5.A.4A2.AB2A6.6B$89.6B7.A3.A.A.2A4.8B$61.D2.CB3.D19.5B7.A2.BA.
A2.13B$2A61.2B2C21.6B6.A.2BA.A5.13B$A.A4.2A52.D2.2C2B.D17.7B6.2A.2BA
5.15B$2.A3.B2AB55.4B19.6B10.3B4.15B$2.2A3.2B53.D3.2BDB18.7B10.2B.B.
17B$4.AB.3B54.D.D4B17.6B4.29B$2.3A6B57.4B16.7B2.16B2A13B$.A2.B.5B58.
4B15.7B2.16B2A14B$.2A3.6B58.4B13.9B.27B3.B2A$5.8B58.4B12.36B4.A2.A$6.
8B58.4B6.B4.20B2.2B2.B3.6B5.2A.A$5.10B58.4B4.2AB.19B14.6B7.A$6.10B58.
4B3.2A19B14.9B6.2A$5.6B2.4B58.4B3.B.17B15.2A4.4B$6.6B2.3B59.4B5.17B
15.A5.4B$5.6B4.2B60.4B4.17B12.3A7.4B$6.2BDBDB4.B.3D2.4D2.2D2.3D42.4B
3.15B.B2A10.A10.4B$5.BD4B.D5.D2.D.D4.D2.D.D2.D42.4B2.12B4.BA.A21.4B$
5.D6B.D4.D2.D.D4.D2.D.D2.D43.15B9.A22.4B$5.2B3CB7.3D2.3D2.4D.D2.D44.
15B8.2A22.4B$4.D.BC2BCB2.D3.D2.D.D4.D2.D.D2.D45.14B33.4B$5.2BC3B7.D2.
D.D4.D2.D.D2.D48.10B35.4B$4.D.BC3BC2.D3.D2.D.4D.D2.D.3D49.9B5.A31.4B$
5.2BC3B74.9B3.3A16.A15.4B10.2A$5.D2BCBCB.D59.A11.9B2.A18.A.A15.4B9.A$
5.BD4B.D17.D.D40.3A13.4B3.2A17.A.A16.4B10.A$8.DBD17.D5.D41.A12.4B.4B
15.3A.2A9.2A5.4B5.5A$6.B.B66.2A12.7B16.A4.B11.A5.4B4.A$27.D2.CB3.D39.
4B11.7B16.3AB2AB9.A.AB.7B2.B3A$30.B2C23.A20.3B11.6B8.2A8.A.2AB.B8.2AB
.7B3.2B.A$27.D2.2C2B.D20.3A12.B.3B.4B11.6B8.A10.6B9.12B4A$31.4B24.A
10.18B2.8B8.A.AB9.4B9.7B2A3BAB2.2A$28.D3.2BDB10.A11.2A3.B5.2B2A26B8.
2AB.3B4.6B8.7B2A2B.B3A2.A$30.D.D4B7.3A11.8B3.2B2A26B10.7B.8B7.10B3.B.
A.2A$43.A16.8B.20B.10B9.17B5.8B8.A$35.4B4.2A15.41B9.15B5.9B7.2A$28.2A
6.9B14.15B.2B2.23B7.16B4.4B2.3B$29.A7.6B14.17B8.21B4.17B4.4B3.5B$29.A
.2A5.6B3.B2.2B2.19B11.15B.25B2.4B7.2A$30.A2.A4.35B12.22BD22B8.A$31.2A
B3.27B.7B13.8B.13BDBD4B.14B10.3A$32.14B2A25B10.8B3.2B2A9B3D4B2.12B13.
A$33.13B2A26B9.2A3.B5.2B2A11BD4B2.12B$34.29B2.8B11.A10.18B4.12B$34.
17B.B.2B11.6B8.3A12.B.3B.7BDB5.12B$35.15B4.3B10.5B9.A19.4B.2BDBD6.9B$
35.15B5.A2B.2A7.4B28.4B4.B2D6.8B$36.13B5.A.A2B.A7.3B28.4B6.B8.6B$38.
13B2.A.AB2.A9.4B25.4B7.2A5.7B$37.8B4.2A.A.A3.A12.2A24.4B9.A5.2A4.2B$
37.6B6.2ABA2.4A.A10.A24.4B9.A7.A3.B2AB$37.5B8.B2.A.A3.A.A10.3A20.4B
10.2A3.3A5.2A$37.B.B9.2A.2A2.A2.A.A12.A19.4B16.A$38.3B9.A.A2.2A3.A32.
4B$37.B2AB9.A.A39.4B$38.2A11.A39.4B$90.4B$89.4B$88.4B$87.4B2$80.2D2.D
2.D.5D$79.D2.D.D2.D3.D$79.D2.D.D2.D3.D$79.D2.D.D2.D3.D$79.D2.D.D2.D3.
D$79.D2.D.D2.D3.D$80.2D3.2D4.D!

This is a little smaller and quicker to recover than your version, but not really a big improvement any more I guess. Must be something better out there, maybe involving a rectifier which makes a good compact merge, but I might have to think a while to come up with it.

EDIT2: There are other possible boat-bit catching lanes, if the geometry turns out to work better -- e.g.,

x = 140, y = 81, rule = LifeHistory
112.2A$111.B2AB$112.2B$107.B3.2B25.A$106.2AB.4B15.5B3.A.A$106.2A8B11.
7B3.A.A$107.B.B2A6B2.2B2.10B4.A$110.2A22B$110.24B$106.28B$106.28B$
105.2A26B$105.2A14B.4B$106.B.11B2.4B$108.10B2.4B$109.14B$108.14B$109.
13B$109.13B$111.2B.8B$114.8B$113.9B$112.10B$111.4B.7B$110.4B2.8B$109.
4B4.8B$108.4B5.9B$107.4B5.6B.3B$106.4B6.7B.2B2A$105.4B8.6B2.BA.A$104.
4B9.6B5.A$103.4B10.6B5.2A$102.4B10.8B$101.4B10.8B$100.4B11.9B$99.4B
12.9B$98.4B12.10B$97.4B13.3B2A5B$96.4B13.4B2A5B$95.4B14.11B$94.4B10.
2A.A12B$93.4B11.A.2A2.8B$92.4B19.7B4.2A$91.4B21.6B4.A$77.A12.4B22.6B.
BA.A$77.3A9.4B22.7B.B2A$80.A7.4B24.8B$79.2A4.6B18.A6.7B$75.B3.11B19.
3A4.7B$49.2A22.4B4.8B11.A11.A2.7B4.B$50.A21.6B.9B12.3A8.2A3.6B.B.2BA$
37.A11.A22.6B.10B14.A7.15BA.A$37.3A9.2A20.19B12.2A3.B5.12B.BA$40.A9.B
19.19B13.8B2.13B$27.2A10.2A9.3B17.17B17.21B$28.A10.5B5.6B16.15B18.20B
$4.3B21.A.AB9.4B3.10B11.17B17.19B$4.3BC10.A10.2AB.3B4.6B2.11B3.2B2.
22B13.21B$5.3BC7.3A12.7B.9BA3B2A15B.21B3.2B2.24B$6.3CB5.A15.17B2A2B2A
15B.B.44B5.B2A$7.4B4.2A15.17B2A18B3.36B.6B6.BA.A$2A6.9B14.17B2A21B.5B
.19B3.8B2.B.5B7.A$.A7.6B14.47B3.14B2.2B2.3B3.3B7.2A7.2A$.A.2A5.6B3.B
2.2B2.19B.B3.13B.4B3.4B3.15B22.A$2.A2.A4.33B7.7B.B4.4B3.A3B5.14B3.4B
16.3A$3.2AB3.27B.6B19.4B3.ABAB6.12B27.A$4.14B2A16B2.B.5B16.B2AB4.2AB
7.9B14.2A$5.13B2A16B7.2A15.3BA6.B7.11B9.A3.2A$6.29B8.A15.B3A6.2A8.7B.
B2A7.A.A$6.17B.B.2B16.3A11.2BAB7.A11.4B2.BA.A5.A.A$7.15B4.3B17.A20.A.
A10.B2A2B5.A5.A$7.15B5.A2B.2A34.2A12.2A7.2A3.2A$8.13B5.A.A2B.A$10.13B
2.A.AB2.A$9.8B4.2A.A.A3.A$9.6B6.2ABA2.4A.A$9.5B8.B2.A.A3.A.A$9.B.B9.
2A.2A2.A2.A.A$10.3B9.A.A2.2A3.A$9.B2AB9.A.A$10.2A11.A!
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Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby gmc_nxtman » June 9th, 2017, 11:00 pm

dvgrn wrote:Ah, right. Is the toggle SET/RESET a requirement?


Yes; in my case, the project would be most benefited by a toggleable bit.

dvgrn wrote:And does the mechanism have to have a boat-bit in it, or could it be some other structure?


At this point, it doesn't necessarily have to be a boat-bit; I originally thought that a boat-bit would yield the most compact mechanism, however, reading it turned out to be more difficult than I thought.

dvrgn wrote:EDIT:The extra Herschel output allows a possible fix -- or a whole lot of them, this is just a first random choice of connections:
...


Hmm. This would work in my instance, however, I feel that a far more efficient solution is still out there. This instance stops the herschel with a boat, and allows it to be reconstructed with a second herschel - the optimal solution (which was in my original, but very slow and large) would be to give a different glider if there is a boat, and use that to restore the boat. That way, the data is preserved in either circumstance, without duplicating the herschel - if the boat is there, the herschel emits a glider and restores it, and if it isn't, it passes through.
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Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby calcyman » June 10th, 2017, 9:32 am

Here's a mechanism discovered by Dave Greene:

x = 102, y = 43, rule = LifeHistory
77.4B$76.4B$75.4B$74.4B$73.4B$72.4B$71.4B$64.3B3.4B$32.A31.9B$30.3A
30.9B$17.A11.A33.8B$17.3A9.2A32.8B10.A$20.A9.B22.5B4.9B8.3A$7.2A10.2A
9.3B20.6B3.11B5.A$8.A10.5B5.6B18.7B2.13B3.2A$8.A.AB9.4B3.10B11.12B.
13B4.B$9.2AB.3B4.6B2.11B3.2B2.2B.25B5.3B$11.7B.9BD3B2A41B3.6B$11.17B
2D2B2A21B2D18B2.10B$12.17B2D22B2C2D19B.11B3.2B2.2B$11.18BD23B2C22BD3B
2A15BD3B$9.19BD48B2D2B2A15BDBDB$7.18B.B3.13B.5B.28B2D18B3DB$7.2BD15B
5.7B.B5.4B4.B2.23BD21BDB$6.3BDBD4B.7B19.4B7.23BD24B$7.2B3D4B2.7B17.4B
7.24B2.13B.4B$6.5BD4B4.2B2A17.4B7.25B2.7B.B5.3B$5.10B3.4B2A16.4B7.2A
2B.20B15.4B$4.4B10.2A19.4B7.ABAB2.18B17.2A$4.3B12.A18.4B7.BA2B4.18B.B
15.A$2.4B10.3A18.4B8.2AB6.18B2A11.3A$2.2A12.A19.4B9.2B7.18B2A11.A$3.A
31.4B10.B8.3B3.13B$3A31.4B21.B2.3B.11B$A32.4B25.2A2.9B$32.4B27.A3.7B$
31.4B25.3A5.4B$30.4B26.A8.5B$29.4B39.2A$28.4B40.A$27.4B42.3A$27.3B45.
A$27.2B!


The two glider inputs open and close the gate. The 'open' and 'close' instructions must strictly be alternated; sending two consecutive pulses of the same type will break the mechanism. Alternatively, if you prefer, you can guard this with a bistable switch to protect against any repeated signals:

x = 179, y = 191, rule = LifeHistory
52.A$52.3A$55.A$54.2A8.2A$54.5B5.A$56.4B.BA.A18.A11.2A$49.B4.6B.B2A
18.A.A9.B2AB$48.2AB.10B20.A.A9.3B$48.2A12B14.2A2.3A.2A9.B.B$49.B.11B
14.A2.A4.B8.5B$51.13B3.4B2.BA.A3.3AB2A6.6B$49.2B.12B2.5B.2B2A6.A.2A4.
8B$48.2A24B10.13B$39.2A7.2A24B12.13B$40.A8.B.B.20B12.15B$40.A.A9.20B
2.B10.15B$41.2A8.26B5.B.17B$44.2B4.51B$44.3B4.21B2A13B2A13B$44.4B3.
21B2A13B2A14B$45.4B3.46B3.B2A$46.4B2.45B4.A2.A$47.4B.29B2.2B2.B3.6B5.
2A.A$48.17B.7B2.4B13.6B7.A$49.16B2.6B17.9B6.2A$50.4B.10B3.3B19.2A4.4B
$51.14B4.B21.A5.4B$52.12B24.3A7.4B$53.11B24.A10.4B$53.11B36.4B$54.9B
38.4B$54.9B39.4B$54.9B3.2A35.4B$54.9B3.A37.4B$55.9BA.A38.4B$56.6B2.2A
40.4B$56.6B45.4B$55.2B2D2BD46.4B40.A16.D$50.2A2.4B3DB47.4B37.3A15.D2B
$49.A.A7BD4B46.4B35.A17.B3D$49.A3.11B47.4B34.2A15.4B$48.2A3.4B2A5B48.
4B30.5B14.4B$54.3B2A5B49.4B20.2A7.3B7.2A6.4B$54.10B50.4B20.A6.5B6.A6.
4B$55.9B51.4B19.A.AB3.5B3.BA.A5.4B$55.9B52.4B19.2AB.9B.B2A5.4B$55.8B
54.4B20.13B6.4B$56.8B54.4B19.13B5.4B14.D$57.6B56.4B15.2B.13B4.4B14.D
2B$57.6B4.2A51.4B13.3B.11B5.4B14.B3D$57.6B4.A53.4B12.10BA2B6.4B14.4B$
56.7B.BA.A54.4B10.10BABAB5.4B14.4B$56.6B2.B2A56.4B9.10BABA5.4B14.4B$
57.8B59.4B8.11BAB4.4B14.4B$57.8B60.4B6.13B4.4B14.4B$56.8B62.4B5.13B3.
4B14.4B$56.7B64.4B4.12B3.4B14.4B$47.2A7.6B66.4B3.10B4.4B14.4B$48.A6.
2B3D2B67.5B.12B.4B14.4B$48.A.AB3.4BD2B68.21B14.4B$49.2AB2.4B3DB67.21B
14.4B$51.11B66.21B14.4B$51.11B65.21B14.4B$51.11B65.20B14.4B$50.11B67.
18B14.4B$51.7B.2B67.2A16B13.4B$51.11B66.2A17B11.4B$52.10B67.19B9.4B$
52.12B66.19B7.4B$53.13B68.16B5.4B$50.17B68.6BA8B4.4B$49.18B68.5BABA6B
4.4B$48.2B2A13B.B2A65.6B2A7B3.4B$49.B2A6B.4B3.BA.A63.17B.4B$42.2A4.8B
4.B8.A62.22B$43.A4.6B15.2A60.22B$43.A.AB.7B75.22B$44.2AB2.6B74.23B$
46.8B74.24B$46.8B74.3B2.19B$47.8B73.2B4.18B$48.7B8.A10.A50.2A8.17B2A$
49.6B6.3A10.3A10.A36.A.A7.18BA.A$49.2B3D2B4.A16.A7.3A36.A8.17B4.A$49.
2BD4B4.2A14.2AB5.A38.2A7.17B5.2A$49.B3D4B.4B14.5B3.2A45.4B3.8B$49.11B
18.8B44.4B4.4B$49.12B17.6B45.4B4.4B$49.12B17.7B43.4B4.4B$50.11B8.B9.
6B42.4B5.3B$53.7B7.2A2B4.2B.8B40.4B$52.8B5.2B2A18B38.4B5.2A$51.9B2.
24B38.4B7.A$50.36B3.2A32.4B5.3A$48.B.36B3.A.A30.4B6.A$47.2A37B4.AB29.
4B$47.2A37B2.3B29.4B$48.39B.4B27.4B$46.5B2.40B25.4B$46.2A6.5B4.30B24.
4B$47.A7.2B.3B4.29B22.4B$44.3A12.2A4.30B20.4B$44.A14.A6.28B20.4B$60.
3A3.26B21.4B$62.A3.3B.22B20.4B$67.B2.21B20.4B$72.23B15.4B$73.21B15.4B
$75.18B15.4B$76.16B2A13.4B$77.15BA.A11.4B$77.13B4.A10.4B$78.11B5.2A8.
4B$79.11B13.4B$80.9B13.4B$80.8B13.4B$81.6B13.4B$80.4B15.4B$79.4B15.4B
$78.4B15.4B$77.4B15.4B$76.4B15.4B$75.4B15.4B$74.4B15.4B$73.4B15.4B$
72.4B15.4B$71.4B15.4B$70.4B9.3B3.4B$51.A17.4B10.9B$49.3A16.4B10.9B$
36.A11.A18.4B11.8B$36.3A9.2A16.4B12.8B10.A$39.A9.B15.4B3.5B4.9B8.3A$
26.2A10.2A9.3B12.4B4.6B3.11B5.A$27.A10.5B5.6B9.4B5.7B2.13B3.2A$27.A.A
B9.4B3.10B5.4B2.12B.13B4.B$28.2AB.3B4.6B2.11B3.32B5.3B$30.7B.9BD3B2A
41B3.6B$30.17B2D2B2A21B2C18B2.10B$31.17B2D22B2D2C19B.11B3.2B2.2B$30.
18BD23B2D22BD3B2A15BD3B$28.19BD48B2D2B2A15BDBDB$26.18B.B3.13B.5B.28B
2D18B3DB$26.2BD15B5.9B5.4B4.B2.23BD21BDB$25.3BDBD4B.7B10.4B5.4B7.23BD
24B$26.2B3D4B2.7B8.4B5.4B7.24B2.13B.4B$25.5BD4B4.2B2A8.4B5.4B7.25B2.
7B.B5.3B$24.10B3.4B2A7.4B5.4B7.2A2B.20B15.4B$23.4B10.2A10.4B5.4B7.ABA
B2.18B17.2A$23.3B12.A9.4B5.4B7.BA2B4.18B.B15.A$21.4B10.3A9.4B5.4B8.2A
B6.18B2A11.3A$21.2A12.A10.4B5.4B9.2B7.18B2A11.A$22.A22.4B5.4B10.B8.3B
3.13B$19.3A22.4B5.4B21.B2.3B.11B$19.A23.4B5.4B25.2A2.9B$42.4B5.4B27.A
3.7B$41.4B5.4B25.3A5.4B$40.4B5.4B26.A8.5B$39.4B5.4B39.2A$30.2A6.4B5.
4B40.A$29.B2AB4.4B5.4B42.3A$30.3B3.4B5.4B45.A$29.B.B3.4B5.4B$28.10B5.
4B$26.11B5.4B$25.11B5.4B$23.12B5.4B$22.12B5.4B$4.A16.14B3.4B$3.A.A13.
17B.4B$3.A.A12.22B$.3A.2A10.6B2A14B$A4.B9.8B2A16B$.3AB2AB6.27B$3.A.2A
32B.B2A$5.31B4.BA.A$7.29B7.A$5.29B9.2A$5.28B$5.4B2A22B$3.2AB.2B2A21B$
2.A.AB.5B.15B.B.B2A$2.A5.3B2.16B2.BA.A$.2A6.3B.12B.2B6.A$8.B2AB.11B
10.2A$9.2A3.9B$15.3B.B$14.2B$13.2BAB$14.A.A$15.A!
What do you do with ill crystallographers? Take them to the mono-clinic!
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calcyman
 
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Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby dvgrn » June 10th, 2017, 10:14 am

gmc_nxtman wrote:Hmm. This would work in my instance, however, I feel that a far more efficient solution is still out there...

Seems like there ought to be a simple improvement, yeah -- seems like I'll have a "D'oh!" moment any time now, and think of something-or-other that I ought to have remembered sooner.

But the requirement that the bit should be toggleable, not just settable, tends to make the circuitry quite a bit bigger. To make the state not change after a READ, we either need a non-destructive READ operation, or we need to do what you've done and route a copy of the output signal back into the TOGGLE input:

x = 122, y = 122, rule = LifeHistory
5$86.A11.2A$85.A.A9.B2AB$73.D3.A3.2A2.A.A9.3B$68.2A.3D2.A.A2.A2.2A.2A
9.B.B$44.3D.4D.5D9.B2ADB4.A.A3.A.A2.B8.5B$43.D4.D6.D12.2B2D5.A.4A2.AB
2A6.6B$43.D4.D6.D10.6B7.A3.A.A.2A4.8B$44.2D2.3D4.D10.5B7.A2.BA.A2.13B
$46.D.D6.D9.6B6.A.2BA.A5.13B$46.D.D6.D8.7B6.2A.2BA5.15B$43.3D2.4D3.D
9.6B10.3B4.15B$65.7B10.2B.B.17B$49.D.D13.6B4.29B$47.D5.D11.7B2.16B2A
13B$65.7B2.16B2A14B$46.D2.CB3.D9.9B.27B3.B2A$48.2B2C12.36B4.A2.A$46.D
2.2C2B.D4.B4.20B2.2B2.B3.6B5.2A.A$50.4B4.2AB.19B14.6B7.A$47.D3.2BDB3.
2A19B14.9B6.2A$49.D.D4B3.B.17B15.2A4.4B10.2A$53.4B5.17B15.A5.4B9.A$
54.4B4.17B12.3A7.4B10.A$56.3B3.15B.B2A10.A2.3A5.4B5.5A$56.4B2.12B4.BA
.A11.A2.A5.6B2.A$57.15B9.A10.2A2.A.AB.7B2.B3A$58.15B8.2A14.2AB.7B3.2B
.A$59.14B26.12B4A$60.12B27.7B2A3BAB2.2A$61.10B28.7B2A2B.B3A2.A$62.9B
28.10B3.B.A.2A$62.9B27.8B8.A$64.6B27.9B7.2A$65.5B26.4B2.3B$66.5B24.4B
3.5B$67.4B23.4B7.2A$68.4B21.4B8.A$69.4B19.4B10.3A$70.4B17.4B13.A$71.
4B15.4B$10.B61.4B13.4B$10.2B61.4B11.4B$10.B3D2.4D2.2D2.3D45.4B9.4B$
10.BD2BD.D4.D2.D.D2.D45.4B7.4B$11.D2BD.D4.D2.D.D2.D46.4B5.4B$11.3D2B
3D2.4D.D2.D47.4B3.4B$11.D.BDBD4.D2.D.D2.D48.4B.4B$11.D2.DBDB3.D2.D.D
2.D49.7B$11.D2.DB4D.D2.D.3D51.5B$16.4B60.5B$17.4B58.7B$18.4B.D.D52.4B
.4B7.A$19.2BDB4.D49.4B3.4B6.3A$20.4B52.4B5.4B8.A$20.D2BDB3.D46.4B7.4B
6.A.A$22.2B2D48.4B9.4B5.A.AB$20.D2.2D2B.D44.4B11.4B5.A3B$24.4B44.4B
13.4B6.4B$21.D3.2BDB42.4B15.4B5.6B$23.D.D4B40.4B17.4B4.7B$27.4B38.4B
19.4B2.8B.4B.B$28.4B36.4B21.17B.B2A$29.4B34.4B23.18B2A$30.4B32.4B24.
16B.2B$31.4B30.4B25.16B$32.4B28.4B26.15B$33.4B26.4B25.2AB.12B$34.4B
24.4B25.A.AB2.11B$35.4B22.4B26.A5.10B$36.4B20.4B26.2A5.2B2A6B$37.4B
18.4B33.3B2A6B$38.4B16.4B35.10B$39.4B14.4B36.8B.B2A.A$40.4B12.4B36.7B
3.B2AB3A$41.4B10.4B37.6B6.B4.A$42.4B8.4B39.6B4.2A.3A$43.4B6.4B40.5B4.
A2.2A$44.4B4.4B40.8B.A.A$45.4B2.4B32.A8.8BA.A.2A.A$46.8B33.3A6.6B.2BA
B.A.2A$47.8B35.A4.2B3D2B2.2B2.A$48.4B.3B12.2A19.2A4.4BD2B3.B.2A$47.9B
12.A15.A4.4B.4B3DB2.A.A2.2A$46.13B6.BA.A15.3A4.11B2.2A2.A2.A$46.13B2.
3B.B2A19.A2.12B7.2A$46.7B2D11B20.2A2.12B$46.6BDBD11B20.B3.11B$47.6BD
11B19.3B4.7B$49.17B16.6B3.8B$49.19B11.10B2.9B$47.2AB.20B2.2B3.23B$46.
A.AB4.13BD15B2A3BD12B.B$46.A6.12BDBD15B2A2B2D13B2A$45.2A4.2AB.2B.B.5B
3D18B2D14B2A$50.A.AB7.4BD21BD15B$50.A11.26BD9B2.5B$49.2A12.4B2.4B.13B
5.5B6.2A$64.4B2.4B4.B.7B3.3B.2B7.A$65.4B2.3B16.2A12.3A$66.4B2.B.2A15.
A14.A$67.4B3.A.A11.3A$68.4B4.A11.A$69.4B3.2A$70.4B$71.4B$68.2D2.D2.D.
5D$67.D2.D.D2.D3.D$67.D2.D.D2.D3.D$67.D2.D.D2.D3.D$67.D2.D.D2.D3.D$
67.D2.D.D2.D3.D$68.2D3.2D4.D$79.4B$80.4B$81.4B$82.4B$83.4B!

This is already not any better than the original, and it doesn't toggle off again properly if another SET signal is sent in.

I've been thinking about the permanent switch that Calcyman just posted -- but for that to work here, you'd have to add quite a bit of extra circuitry: split a signal, send one branch to test the permanent switch, delay the other branch and use it to check whether a signal came out the other side... it gets big and awkward very quickly, and there's no easy toggle there either.

Meanwhile, the memory cell originally posted is looking pretty good, all things considered! Something smaller and faster will turn up eventually, but it's not as easy as I was hoping it would be.
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dvgrn
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Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby gmc_nxtman » June 10th, 2017, 11:01 am

dvgrn wrote:But the requirement that the bit should be toggleable, not just settable, tends to make the circuitry quite a bit bigger. To make the state not change after a READ, we either need a non-destructive READ operation, or we need to do what you've done and route a copy of the output signal back into the TOGGLE input
...


This would actually be far more efficient than the original, but yeah, the toggle off isn't looking so good.

dvgrn wrote:I've been thinking about the permanent switch that Calcyman just posted -- but for that to work here, you'd have to add quite a bit of extra circuitry...it gets big and awkward very quickly, and there's no easy toggle there either.


An RS-flip flop could definitely be made to work in my situation, although it does get pretty big as you mentioned.

dvgrn wrote:Meanwhile, the memory cell originally posted is looking pretty good, all things considered! Something smaller and faster will turn up eventually, but it's not as easy as I was hoping it would be.


I have one idea for something that could be made much smaller (although it has to be a very specific reaction), which is to use a syringe, and have a toggleable h-to-block, like so:

x = 82, y = 33, rule = LifeHistory
19.B47.B$18.3D45.3D$18.BDB45.BDB$17.3D2B43.3D2B$17.5B43.5B$16.6B7.A
34.6B7.A$D15.6B6.A.A17.D15.6B6.A.A$D.D14.5B6.A.A17.D.D14.5B6.A.A$3D.
9D4.6B4.2A.3A15.3D.9D4.6B4.2A.3A$2.D10.D2.6B6.B4.A16.D10.D2.6B6.B4.A$
14.D.D6B3.B2AB3A29.D.D6B3.B2AB3A$15.2D8B.B2A.A32.2D8B.B2A.A$14.3D10B
35.3D10B$16.3B2D6B37.3B2C6B$17.2B2D6B38.2B2C6B$17.10B38.10B$16.3BA8B
36.3BA8B$11.2A.5B2A7B31.2A.5B2A7B$10.A.A5BABA8B29.A.A5BABA8B$10.A2.
17B28.A2.17B$9.2A3.16B.2B24.2A3.16B.2B$14.18B2A28.18B2A$15.B.13B.B2A
29.B.13B.B2A$18.8B.4B.B33.8B.4B.B$19.7B41.7B$19.6B42.6B$19.4B44.4B$
17.A3B44.A3B$16.A.AB44.A.AB$16.A.A45.A.A$17.A47.A$14.3A45.3A$14.A47.A
!


A lot of bellman/ptbsearch/catforce searching would have to be made for such an edgy reaction, and especially that it's lucky enough to be a toggle, otherwise an RS-flip flop would need to be used again.

At this point, all I really need is some sort of unit that can be toggled by one input to let gliders/herschels through. The difficulty is making a toggle without some complicated semi-snark/rs-flip-flop mechanism.
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gmc_nxtman
 
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Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby calcyman » June 10th, 2017, 12:22 pm

gmc_nxtman wrote:At this point, all I really need is some sort of unit that can be toggled by one input to let gliders/herschels through. The difficulty is making a toggle without some complicated semi-snark/rs-flip-flop mechanism.


You should have said that to begin with!

Code: Select all
x = 198, y = 114, rule = LifeHistory
101.2A$101.A.A$103.A4.2A$99.4A.2A2.A2.A$99.A2.A.A.A.A.2A$101.BABABA.A
$102.B2ABA.A$103.2B.BA$102.3B$93.2A6.4B$94.A6.B2A3B$94.A.AB3.B2A3B$
95.2AB.10B$97.13B$97.14B$97.15B$99.8B2.4B$99.6B5.4B$98.9B4.4B$97.4B4.
2A5.4B$96.4B5.A7.4B$95.4B7.3A5.4B$94.4B10.A6.4B$93.4B19.4B$92.4B21.4B
$91.4B23.4B$90.4B25.4B$69.A19.4B27.4B$69.3A16.4B29.4B$72.A14.4B31.4B$
71.2A13.4B33.4B$71.5B9.4B35.4B$66.2A5.3B8.4B37.4B$66.A.A3.5B6.4B39.4B
$68.A2.6B5.4B41.4B$68.2A.8B2.4B43.4B$70.9B.4B45.4B$70.13B47.4B$70.B2A
9B49.4B$69.2B2A8B51.4B$69.11B53.4B$67.14B53.4B$67.13B2.B52.4B$65.15B.
B2A52.4B$64.2A16B2A53.4B$64.2A14B.2B55.4B$65.3B2C10B59.4B$65.3B2C9B
61.4B$67.7B2.4B61.4B$.197B$.4A46B4A14B2C127B$A3BA45BA3BA14B2C127B$2.
2BA49BA143B$A.BA46BA2BA144B$62.11B9.4B61.4B$61.4B.6B11.4B61.4B$60.4B
3.6B11.4B61.4B13.A$59.4B5.5B2A10.4B61.4B10.3A$58.4B10.BA.A10.4B61.4B
8.A$57.4B10.B3.A11.4B61.4B7.2A$56.4B15.2A11.4B61.4B3.5B$55.4B30.4B61.
4B2.3B$54.4B32.4B61.9B7.2A$53.4B34.4B61.8B8.A$52.4B36.4B61.10B3.B.A.
2A$51.4B38.4B60.7B2A2B.B3A2.A$50.4B40.4B59.7B2A3BAB2.2A$49.4B42.4B58.
12B4A$48.4B44.4B55.2AB.7B3.2B.A$47.4B46.4B53.A.AB.7B2.B3A$46.3AB48.4B
52.A5.4B4.A$45.3BA50.4B50.2A5.4B5.5A$44.3BA52.4B55.4B10.A$43.4B54.4B
53.4B9.A$42.4B56.4B51.4B10.2A$41.4B58.4B49.4B$40.4B60.4B47.4B$39.4B
62.4B45.4B$38.4B64.4B43.4B$37.4B66.4B41.4B$36.4B68.4B39.4B$35.4B70.4B
37.4B$34.4B72.4B35.4B$33.4B74.4B33.4B$32.4B76.4B31.4B$31.4B78.4B29.4B
$30.4B80.4B27.4B$29.4B82.4B25.4B$28.4B84.4B23.4B$27.4B86.4B21.4B$26.
4B88.4B19.4B$25.4B90.4B6.A10.4B$24.4B92.4B5.3A7.4B$23.4B94.4B7.A5.4B$
22.4B96.4B5.2A4.4B$21.4B98.4B4.9B$20.4B100.4B5.6B$19.4B102.4B2.8B$18.
4B104.15B$17.4B106.14B$16.3AB108.13B$16.2BA110.10B.B2A$17.A113.3B2AB
3.BA.A$131.3B2AB6.A$133.4B6.2A$133.3B$130.AB.2B$129.A.AB2AB$129.A.ABA
BAB$126.2A.A.A.A.A2.A$126.A2.A2.2A.4A$128.2A4.A$134.A.A$135.2A!
What do you do with ill crystallographers? Take them to the mono-clinic!
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calcyman
 
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Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby gmc_nxtman » June 10th, 2017, 12:25 pm

calcyman wrote:You should have said that to begin with!
...


Just what I needed! As for why I didn't say that to begin with, I already had a partial solution involving boat-bits, so I thought it would be easier to complete that, but this turned out to be more efficient. Thanks!
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gmc_nxtman
 
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Re: Thread For Requesting Help

Postby BlinkerSpawn » June 10th, 2017, 3:15 pm

Let's tighten that up a bit:
x = 134, y = 96, rule = LifeHistory
94.2A$94.A.A$96.A4.2A$92.4A.2A2.A2.A$92.A2.A.A.A.A.2A$94.BABABA.A$95.
B2ABA.A$96.2B.BA$95.3B$86.2A6.4B$87.A6.B2A3B$87.A.AB3.B2A3B$88.2AB.
10B$90.13B$90.14B$90.15B$92.8B2.4B$92.6B5.4B$91.9B4.4B$90.4B4.2A5.4B$
69.A19.4B5.A7.4B$69.3A16.4B7.3A5.4B13.A$72.A14.4B10.A6.4B10.3A$71.2A
13.4B19.4B8.A$71.5B9.4B21.4B7.2A$66.2A5.3B8.4B23.4B3.5B$66.A.A3.5B6.
4B25.4B2.3B$68.A2.6B5.4B27.9B7.2A$68.2A.8B2.4B29.8B8.A$70.9B.4B31.10B
3.B.A.2A$70.13B32.7B2A2B.B3A2.A$70.B2A9B33.7B2A3BAB2.2A$69.2B2A8B34.
12B4A$69.11B33.2AB.7B3.2B.A$67.14B31.A.AB.7B2.B3A$67.13B2.B29.A5.4B4.
A$65.15B.B2A27.2A5.4B5.5A$64.2A16B2A33.4B10.A$64.2A14B.2B33.4B9.A$65.
3B2C10B35.4B10.2A$65.3B2C9B35.4B$67.7B2.4B33.4B$.133B$.4A46B4A14B2C
63B$A3BA45BA3BA14B2C63B$2.2BA49BA79B$A.BA46BA2BA80B$62.11B9.4B21.4B$
61.4B.6B11.4B19.4B$60.4B3.6B11.4B6.A10.4B$59.4B5.5B2A10.4B5.3A7.4B$
58.4B10.BA.A10.4B7.A5.4B$57.4B10.B3.A11.4B5.2A4.4B$56.4B15.2A11.4B4.
9B$55.4B30.4B5.6B$54.4B32.4B2.8B$53.4B34.15B$52.4B36.14B$51.4B38.13B$
50.4B40.10B.B2A$49.4B42.4B2AB3.BA.A$48.4B44.3B2AB6.A$47.4B46.5B6.2A$
46.3AB48.3B$45.3BA46.AB.3B$44.3BA46.A.AB2AB$43.4B47.A.ABABAB$42.4B45.
2A.A.A.A.A2.A$41.4B46.A2.A2.2A.4A$40.4B49.2A4.A$39.4B56.A.A$38.4B58.
2A$37.4B$36.4B$35.4B$34.4B$33.4B$32.4B$31.4B$30.4B$29.4B$28.4B$27.4B$
26.4B$25.4B$24.4B$23.4B$22.4B$21.4B$20.4B$19.4B$18.4B$17.4B$16.3AB$
16.2BA$17.A!
LifeWiki: Like Wikipedia but with more spaceships. [citation needed]

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