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(23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

For discussion of specific patterns or specific families of patterns, both newly-discovered and well-known.

Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby dvgrn » December 30th, 2014, 11:52 am

Sphenocorona wrote:It would still be possible to make a helix gun which ignores the extreme repetitiveness of the helix, and naively builds each part with a different set of guns. It would admittedly be extremely bulky and ugly, but it'd work.

Yes, I'm afraid I wasn't even bothering to consider optimizations like helix-simulating rakes -- plain stupid brute-force proof of concept seems like the only reasonable way to go.

Sphenocorona wrote:A better way to make the required gliders for constructing the helix is found in the waterbear itself: Use a number of toggle-able edge-shooting xWSS guns to produce a helix which burns at the required velocity.

All of these self-constructing spaceship patterns conveniently contain workable suggested recipes for most of their pieces (just not the Herschels in the waterbear and centipede, the pi climbers in the Caterpillar or the bi-loaves in the HBK, which luckily are all fairly trivial to construct).

Once a helix starts burning, it doesn't seem like a good idea to allow it to stop again. Just put in one high-period edge-shooter gun for each *WSS in a long, gradually narrowing helix -- each stream of *WSSes ends just before the partial built-so-far front of the ship picks up the construction. The guns could use the same recipe as the waterbear, for safety's sake -- two NEward gliders plus a sideways spaceship for the LWSSes, etc.

But that's the easy part. Once a given stream of gliders, glider/loaves, beehives, or whatever is being generated at the front of the helix, the Herschels will need to be placed at the right location in the stream, and the Herschels' output gliders will have to be absorbed or shot down until other nearby Herschels or other structures are in place to take over that job. With luck there's a way to design edge-shooter guns to drop Herschels in the right places, but I think they might tend to get in each others' way quite a bit.

An interesting idea would be to build a huge stable seed constellation in the triangular "Tower of Hanoi" area. As glider streams from the burning helix first enter an area, the first glider in each stream triggers a seed constellation that collapses into a Herschel in the right location to burn following gliders in the stream. Hey presto, a freeze-dried waterbear comes back to life! (Real-life waterbears can do something vaguely similar, I understand.)

... Getting the various rakes to start up and support each other correctly will be a huge mess, though. It's "just" a matter of dropping blocks or sending gliders to absorb early rake output until other components can catch up, but there's no guarantee there will be room to do that easily.

In general these megafauna guns are great fun to think about, but they're orders of magnitude more complicated than the original spaceships -- which were already a plenty big enough headache, really. An HBK gun is a little bit tempting, actually, but only because it would be so (relatively) simple: no moving parts to speak of...!

But I think the next item on my To-Do list that's anywhere near this complexity is a quadratic-growth replicator, not any kind of monster gun.
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Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby simsim314 » December 30th, 2014, 12:29 pm

dvgrn wrote:But I think the next item on my To-Do list that's anywhere near this complexity is a quadratic-growth replicator, not any kind of monster gun.


I was thinking about HBK gun in conext of UC. It seems to me the algorithm that constructs SL constellation from two directions (like Gemini), can simply be applied to construct the HBK as well.

After having a sequential recipe, one can optimize it to work in parallel.
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Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby chris_c » December 30th, 2014, 1:13 pm

simsim314 wrote:I was thinking about HBK gun in conext of UC.


Yeah, UC is probably the best way to make an HBK gun: let's be honest, there's no need to rush in building the materials when you have to wait so long for the ship to get out of the way afterwards ;).

As a small starter here is an HB synthesis using two slow pairs. It seems to be good enough to make all of the HB's in the Parallel HBK but I'm not 100%.

x = 59, y = 57, rule = B3/S23
51b2o$50bo2bo$7bo42bobo$8bo39b2obo$6b3o38bo2bo$47bobo$48bo6$41b2o$40bo
2bo$19bo20bobo13b2o$20bo17b2obo13bo2bo$18b3o16bo2bo14bobo$37bobo13b2ob
o$38bo13bo2bo$52bobo$53bo6$46b2o$45bo2bo$45bobo$43b2obo$42bo2bo$42bobo
$43bo6$36b2o$35bo2bo$35bobo$33b2obo$17bo14bo2bo$17b2o13bobo$16bobo14bo
10$b2o$obo$2bo!


EDIT: Oh, looking again, a HB facing in the opposite direction is definitely preferable. By my calculations it would take less than 100,000,000 generations for the Parallel HBK to escape its own envelope, but it would take far far longer to escape the shooting range that is implied by the above synthesis.

EDIT2: the best I could find coming from the other side:

x = 46, y = 81, rule = B3/S23
44bo$43bo$43b3o18$23bo$23bobo$23b2o14$2bobo$2b2o$3bo6$3o$o$bo21$25b2o$
25bobo$25bo9$40b3o$40bo$41bo!
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Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby biggiemac » December 30th, 2014, 3:27 pm

dvgrn wrote:
Sphenocorona wrote:It would still be possible to make a helix gun which ignores the extreme repetitiveness of the helix, and naively builds each part with a different set of guns. It would admittedly be extremely bulky and ugly, but it'd work.

Yes, I'm afraid I wasn't even bothering to consider optimizations like helix-simulating rakes -- plain stupid brute-force proof of concept seems like the only reasonable way to go.


Actually, if it is possible to create an orthogonal p59 helix that advances by 18 cells each generation, emitting a backwards glider, then here's a game plan for waterbear synth.

The above helix, if it exists, can be synthesized in pairs by stationary p46 technology (!!!!!). Its gliders would simulate the waterbear helix. That would allow the Hs to start climbing and synthesize the actual helix. This simulated helix would have to be far enough ahead of the waterbear that the ship would be self sufficient before it would crash into it. But it should work. I'll look into running the helix search script..
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Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby biggiemac » December 31st, 2014, 1:45 am

The helix search script found a simple burning reaction, if we can coax a glider out, that orthogonally simulates a x2 waterbear helix. Ivan was working on substituting some other combination for the left HWSS to coax out the glider; the 4 LWSS are the part responsible for advancing the reaction. I'm no whiz with p46 engineering but for a bit of practice I've made a constructor for a piece of it. I'm running into trouble trying to insert the 4th LWSS, and still at a complete loss on how to insert the two HWSS, but it's a start.

x = 203, y = 258, rule = B3/S23
25bo$24b3o$23b2obo$19b2o2b3o$20b2o2b2o$19bo6$25b3o$10b3o11bo2bo$10bo2b
o13bo5bo$10bo16bo4b3o$10bo13bobo5bob2o$11bobo19b3o$33b3o$33b3o$33b2o3$
10bo$9b3o13bo$8b2obo12b3o$2b3o3b3o13bob2o$bo2bo4b2o14b3o$4bo20b2o$o3bo
$o3bo$4bo$bobo3$25b3o$10b3o12bo2bo$9bo2bo12bo7bo$12bo12bo6b3o$12bo13bo
bo2b2obo$9bobo19b3o$31b3o$31b3o$32b2o3$10bo$9b3o13bo$9bob2o11b3o$2b3o
5b3o10b2obo$2bo2bo4b2o11b3o$2bo21b2o$2bo3bo$2bo3bo$2bo$3bobo3$25b3o$
10b3o11bo2bo122b3o$10bo2bo13bo5bo116bo2bo$10bo16bo4b3o115bo$10bo13bobo
5bob2o114bo$11bobo19b3o115bobo$33b3o$33b3o$33b2o3$10bo139bo$9b3o13bo
123b3o13bo$8b2obo12b3o121b2obo12b3o$2b3o3b3o13bob2o120b3o13bob2o$bo2bo
4b2o14b3o121b2o14b3o$4bo20b2o138b2o$o3bo$o3bo$4bo$bobo3$25b3o$10b3o12b
o2bo121b3o$9bo2bo12bo7bo115bo2bo$12bo12bo6b3o117bo$12bo13bobo2b2obo
117bo$9bobo19b3o115bobo$31b3o$31b3o$32b2o3$10bo139bo$9b3o13bo123b3o13b
o$9bob2o11b3o122bob2o11b3o23b2o5b2o$2b3o5b3o10b2obo123b3o10b2obo23b2o
5b2o$2bo2bo4b2o11b3o124b2o11b3o$2bo21b2o138b2o$2bo3bo$2bo3bo$2bo$3bobo
3$25b3o$10b3o11bo2bo122b3o$10bo2bo13bo5bo116bo2bo$10bo16bo4b3o115bo$
10bo13bobo5bob2o114bo$11bobo19b3o115bobo35b3o5b3o$33b3o153b3o5b3o$33b
3o154b2o5b2o$33b2o157bo3bo$190bo2bobo2bo$189bo3bobo3bo$10bo139bo39bo2b
obo2bo$9b3o13bo123b3o13bo24b3o3b3o$8b2obo12b3o121b2obo12b3o$2b3o3b3o
13bob2o120b3o13bob2o$bo2bo4b2o14b3o121b2o14b3o26bo5bo$4bo20b2o138b2o
26b3o3b3o$o3bo187b2o2bobo2b2o$o3bo187b2ob2ob2ob2o$4bo190b2ob2o$bobo
189bobo3bobo$192bo2bo3bo2bo$195bo3bo$25b3o164bobo5bobo$10b3o12bo2bo
121b3o31bo8bo7bo$9bo2bo12bo7bo115bo2bo30bo$12bo12bo6b3o117bo30b3o$12bo
13bobo2b2obo117bo$9bobo19b3o115bobo$31b3o$31b3o$32b2o3$10bo139bo$9b3o
13bo123b3o13bo$9bob2o11b3o122bob2o11b3o5bo$2b3o5b3o10b2obo123b3o10b2ob
o5bobo18b2o5b2o$2bo2bo4b2o11b3o124b2o11b3o6b2o19b2o5b2o$2bo21b2o138b2o
$2bo3bo$2bo3bo$2bo$3bobo2$183b2o$25b3o155b2o$10b3o11bo2bo122b3o$10bo2b
o13bo5bo62b2o12b4o5b3o28bo2bo15b2o$10bo16bo4b3o61b2o12bob2o6b2o28bo17b
obo13b2o$10bo13bobo5bob2o74bo8bo30bo16b2obo13b2o$11bobo19b3o75b2o13bo
2b2o12b2o6bobo14b2o$33b3o91b2obo12b2o24bo$33b3o75b2o16bo$33b2o75bo7bo
8b3o39bo$96b2o12bob2o4b4o46b2o$96b2o12b4o4b2o7b3o29b2o6b2obo13b2o$10bo
118bo20bo8b2o7bobo13b2o$9b3o13bo94bo6b2obo12b2o4b3o17b2o$8b2obo12b3o
99bo2b2o12b2o3b2obo$2b3o3b3o13bob2o120b3o32b2o$bo2bo4b2o14b3o121b2o32b
2o$4bo20b2o$o3bo$o3bo90b2o31bo2bo$4bo90b2o9b4o22bo$bobo101bo3bo18bo3bo
$109bo19b4o$105bo2bo55b2o5b2o$25b3o136b2o5b2o$10b3o12bo2bo121b3o$9bo2b
o12bo7bo115bo2bo$12bo12bo6b3o106b3o8bo$12bo13bobo2b2obo108bo8bo$9bobo
19b3o108bo6bobo$31b3o$31b3o104bo$32b2o104b2o$95b2o5b2o33bobo$71b2o5b2o
14bo2bo3bo2bo$10bo60b2o5b2o15bo2bobo2bo$9b3o13bo72bobo54b3o$9bob2o11b
3o69b3ob3o52bo$2b3o5b3o10b2obo67b3o5b3o25b2o24bo$2bo2bo4b2o11b3o46bo5b
o15b2o7b2o24bobo31b2o7b2o$2bo21b2o45b3o3b3o14b2o7b2o26bo31bob2o3b2obo$
2bo3bo63b2o2bobo2b2o14bob2ob2obo59bo3bobo3bo$2bo3bo63b2ob2ob2ob2o13bo
2bo3bo2bo58b2o2bobo2b2o$2bo70b2ob2o13b2obo9bob2o18b2o36b3o3b3o$3bobo
65bobo3bobo11b2obo2bo3bo2bob2o19b2o36bo5bo$70bo2bo3bo2bo14b2o5b2o22bo$
73bo3bo$25b3o42bobo5bobo$10b3o11bo2bo43bo7bo70b3o$10bo2bo13bo5bo116bo
2bo$10bo16bo4b3o83b3o29bo$10bo13bobo5bob2o84bo29bo10b3o3b3o$11bobo19b
3o83bo31bobo7bo2bobo2bo$33b3o100b2o5b2o15bo3bobo3bo$33b3o79bo20b2o5b2o
15b4o3b4o$33b2o80b2o44bo7bo$114bobo2$10bo$9b3o13bo$8b2obo12b3o$2b3o3b
3o13bob2o79b2o$bo2bo4b2o14b3o78bobo$4bo20b2o53bo27bo$o3bo73bobo$o3bo
74b2o$4bo98b2o33bo3bo$bobo100b2o32bo3bo$68bo7bo26bo$68b2o5b2o$25b3o40b
3o3b3o58b2obo3bob2o15b2o5b2o$10b3o12bo2bo41b2ob2o61b3o3b3o5b3o8b2o5b2o
$9bo2bo12bo7bo36bo3bo62bo5bo5bo2bo$12bo12bo6b3o32b2o7b2o17b3o54bo$12bo
13bobo2b2obo32b2o7b2o13bo5bo54bo$9bobo19b3o37bobo18bo3bo52bobo$31b3o
33bo2bo3bo2bo12b3o25b2o$31b3o34b3o3b3o41b2o$32b2o61b2o3b2o8bo$94bo2bob
o2bo7bo2b2o$93bo9bo5bo5bo3b2o$68b2o5b2o15b2o9b2o5bobo2b2o2b2o$68b2o5b
2o16bo9bo6bo3b2o17b3o3b3o$94bo2bobo2bo9b3o17bo2bo3bo2bo$84b2o9b2o3b2o
30b2obo3bob2o$83bobo26b3o$85bo24bo3b2o31bobo$94b2o14bobo2b2o2b2o27b2o$
94b2o13bo5bo3b2o27bo$110bo2b2o$110bo62b2o$118b2o53b2o$118b2o$152b2o$
151bobob2o8b2o7b2o$150b2o3b2o9b2o6b2o$50b2o2bobo15b3o76bobob2o5b5o$43b
2o4b3obo3bo16bo77b2o8b4o$43b2o3b2o6bo16bo$49bob5o26b2obo76b4o$50b3o24b
3o2b2o2bo3b2o41b2o5b2o20b5o$78b2o6bo3b2o41b2o5b2o7b2o15b2o6b2o$50b3o
26b3o3b2o62b2o14b2o7b2o$49bob5o24bo3bo$43b2o3b2o6bo$43b2o4b3obo3bo22bo
3bo88b2o$50b2o2bobo22b3o3b2o86b2o$78b2o6bo3b2o$77b3o2b2o2bo3b2o$82b2ob
o!


Any help would be appreciated.

If we can produce a simulated rake to start off the first two Herschels, we can construct the whole waterbear by just giving it the proper Herschels at the right time.

As is, I'm now just curious how much can be simply constructed with helices. If we have two helices advancing at different rates, could their outputs collide to create a trail of beehives with separation (23,5)? I feel like that's a generalization of the principle behind the blockstacker. Use helix-like rakes to construct a trail from some still life, repeated with (x,y) displacement.

Edit: this much so far!
x = 286, y = 251, rule = B3/S23
4$268b2o5b2o$136b3o129b2o5b2o$135bo2bo10b3o$138bo10bo2bo$138bo10bo$
135bobo11bo$150bobo5$136bo$135b3o13bo$135bob2o11b3o$136b3o10b2obo115bo
7bo$5b2o5b2o122b2o11b3o115bobo5bobo$5b2o5b2o136b2o118bo3bo$267bo2bo3bo
2bo$268bobo3bobo$249bo20b2ob2o$249b2o8b2o6b2ob2ob2ob2o$250b2o7b2o6b2o
2bobo2b2o$245b2o2b2o17b3o3b3o$212b2o8b3o44bo5bo$136b3o73b2o8bo3bo$136b
o2bo9b3o70bo4bo43b3o3b3o$136bo11bo2bo71bo3bo17b2o2b2o19bo2bo3bo2bo$
136bo14bo98b2o7b2o13bobo$137bobo11bo71bo3bo11bo9b2o8b2o9b2o7b2o$148bob
o71bo4bo12b2o7bo20b2o7b2o$5bo7bo198b2o8bo3bo12b2o32bo3bo$3b2ob2o3b2ob
2o196b2o8b3o48b2ob2o$271b3o3b3o$6bobobobo258b2o5b2o$4bo3bobo3bo121bo
134bo7bo$4bo2b2ob2o2bo6b2o9b2o101b3o13bo109bobo$5b3o3b3o7b2o8b2o101b2o
bo12b3o108b2o$6bo5bo19b5o16bo3bo76b3o13bob2o108bo$33b4o15bo5bo9b2o65b
2o14b3o$58bo9b2o81b2o$33b4o16bo3b2o191bobo$2b3o3b3o21b5o17b3o194b2o$2b
o2bobo2bo10b2o8b2o218bo$bo3bobo3bo9b2o9b2o7bobo10b3o$2bo2bobo2bo30b2o
10bo3b2o$4bo3bo33bo15bo9b2o140bob2o$2b2o5b2o41bo5bo9b2o139bo2b2o2b3o
12b2o18bo13b2o$b3o5b3o41bo3bo78b3o70bo6b2o13b2o16b2o14b2o4b2o5b2o$b3o
5b3o123bo2bo10b3o47bobo2b2o3b2o3b3o33b2o6b3o10b2o5b2o$18bo119bo10bo2bo
31b2o12bo3bob3o4bo3bo41bo3bo$19b2o117bo10bo34b2o13bo6b2o49b2ob2o$18b2o
115bobo11bo50b5obo4bo3bo$150bobo50b3o3b2o3b3o30bo9b2ob2o$209bo6b2o13b
2o13bo12bo$31bo171b3o3bo2b2o2b3o12b2o13b3o$29b2o169b5obo3bob2o$30b2o
152b2o13bo6b2o$136bo47b2o12bo3bob3o51bo7bo$135b3o13bo47bobo2b2o32bobo
16bo2bo3bo2bo$135bob2o11b3o85b2o21bobo$64b2o3bo66b3o10b2obo86bo21bobo$
15b2o12bobo17b2o13b3obob2o64b2o11b3o109bobo$2b2o5b2o4b2o4b3o6b2o17b2o
13b3o4bo9bo68b2o67bo37bo2bo3bo2bo$2b2o5b2o19bo36bo3bo5b2o2bo138b2o36b
3o3b3o$20bo3bo43b3o5bo5bo13b2o121b2o14bo$20bo3bo50b2o2bobo14b2o137bobo
$21bobo44b3o5b2o3bo153b2o$21b3o10bo32bo3bo5b3o$32bobo14b2o13b3o4bo80b
4o$33b2o14b2o13b3obob2o5b3o71bo3bo41b4o$64b2o3bo6b2o3bo54b3o11bo4bo17b
2o21b6o17b2o33b2o13b2o$75b2o2bobo14b2o38bo2bo10bo3bo17b2ob4o16b2ob4o
16b2ob4o29b2o2b2o5b2o2b2o$41bo34bo5bo13b2o38bo13bo2bo19b6o17b2o21b6o
33b2o5b2o$15bo7bo18b2o33b2o2bo54bo14b2o21b4o42b4o$13bob2o5b2obo15b2o
38bo55bobo$13bo3b2ob2o3bo125b2o12b2o2b2o$14bo3bobo3bo125b2o14b4o$15b3o
3b3o37bobo88bo13b4o$45bo15b2o105bo70bob2o$46bo15bo132b2o5b2o34bo2b2o2b
3o12b2o$44b3o89bo58b2o5b2o34bo6b2o13b2o$135b3o13bo19bo56bo3b3o3b2o3b3o
$134b2obo12b3o17b2o41b2o12bobo2b5o3bo3bo$134b3o13bob2o16bobo40b2o12bo
3b2o3b2o$57b4o42b4o28b2o14b3o24bo49bo2bo3b2o3bo3bo$11b2o13b2o28b6o21b
2o17b6o21b2o20b2o24b2o50b3o3bo2b2o3b3o$11b2o2b2o5b2o2b2o28b4ob2o16b4ob
2o16b4ob2o16b4ob2o31bo13bobo58bo6b2o13b2o$15b2o5b2o36b2o17b6o21b2o17b
6o31b2o65b3o3bo2bo2b2o2b3o12b2o$80b4o37bo4b4o32bobo63bo2bo3b2o2bob2o$
121b4o88b2o12bo3b2o3b2o$123b3o87b2o12bobo2b5o$117bo8bo67b3o5b3o23bo3b
3o$117b2o3b4o69b3o3b3o$35b2o3bo75bobo3b3o7bo49b2o9bob4ob4obo$20b2o13b
3obob2o41b2o5b2o30bo8b2o47b2o11b2o2bobo2b2o$20b2o13b3o4bo41b2o5b2o38bo
bo49bo11b3o3b3o$38bo3bo4b2o2bobo135b2o5bo5bo$39b3o4b3obo3bo12b2o119b2o
$45b2o6bo13b2o105b2o14bo$39b3o4bob5o120b2o$38bo3bo4b3o62b2o61bo$20b2o
13b3o4bo41b3o3b3o20b2o$20b2o13b3obob2o4b3o33bo2bo3bo2bo18bo56bo39b3o5b
4o12b2o$35b2o3bo5bob5o30bo3bobo3bo11b2o29bo32b2o38bo7b2obo12b2o$45b2o
6bo13b2o13b2obobobobob2o11b2o27b3o13bo4b2o9bob3o22bo14b2obo7bo$46b3obo
3bo12b2o13b2ob2o3b2ob2o10bo14b2o13bob2o11b3o3b2o13b2o20b2o16b2o5b2o$
47b2o2bobo29b3o5b3o27b2o13b3o10b2obo17b2o21bobo$120bo15b2o11b3o18bo40b
2o5b2o$150b2o57b2obo7bo$170bo35b4o7b2obo12b2o$170b2o34b6o5b4o12b2o$
101bo54b2o13b2o$101b2o53b2o9bob3o$100bobo66b2o$94bo74bo$94b2o90b2o$93b
obo13bo76b2o17b2o$53b2o14b3o37b2o93b2o$53b2o12bo3bo36bobo9b2o84bo$66bo
4bo47b2ob2o6b2o47b3o3b3o$66bo3bo49bo2bo6b2o47bo2bobo2bo$120bo2bo57b2ob
2o$66bo3bo50b2o$66bo4bo17b2o86bo11bo$53b2o12bo3bo8b2o8b2o29b2o55bo9bo$
53b2o14b3o8b2o7bo30bo2bo56bobobobo$109bo10bo2bo6b2o4bo43bobobobo$108bo
bo8b2ob2o6b2o3b3o13bo29b2ob2o31bo$120b2o12b2obo12b3o25bo2bo3bo2bo27b2o
20b2obo$134b3o13bob2o25b2o5b2o28bobo14b3o2b2o2bo3b2o$100b2o33b2o14b3o
80b2o6bo3b2o$100b2o49b2o53b3o3bo22b3o3b2o$199b2o3b5o2bobo22bo3bo$199b
2o2b2o3b2o3bo$78bo125b2o3bo2bo23bo3bo$78b2o125bo3b3o23b3o3b2o$77bobo
154b2o6bo3b2o$205bo3b3o21b3o2b2o2bo3b2o$204b2o3bo2bo25b2obo$199b2o2b2o
3b2o3bo$199b2o3b5o2bobo$100b3o3b3o97b3o3bo$54b2o43bo2bo3bo2bo69b2o5b2o
$53bo49bobo73b2o5b2o$40b2o10bo2b2o46bobo$40b2o10bo2bo18bo28bobo$52bobo
11b2o4bo2bo23bo2bo3bo2bo$53b2o12b2o3b5o10b2o11bo7bo$66bo5b3ob2o9b2o$
53b2o18b2obo59bo$52bobo19b2o59b3o13bo$40b2o10bo2bo79bob2o11b3o23b2o5b
2o$40b2o10bo2b2o17b2o60b3o10b2obo23b2o5b2o$53bo19b2obo59b2o11b3o$54b2o
16b3ob2o9b2o61b2o$72b5o10b2o$72bo2bo$74bo25b2o5b2o$100b2o5b2o8$103b2o
5b2o63b3o5b3o$101bo2bo5bo2bo61b3o5b3o$176b2o5b2o$106bobo69bo3bo$101b2o
3bobo3b2o62bo2bobo2bo$175bo3bobo3bo$105bo3bo26bo39bo2bobo2bo$135b3o13b
o24b3o3b3o$134b2obo12b3o$134b3o13bob2o$103b2o5b2o23b2o14b3o26bo5bo$
151b2o26b3o3b3o$102bo9bo65b2o2bobo2b2o$102bo3bobo3bo65b2ob2ob2ob2o$
102bo3bobo3bo68b2ob2o$103bobo3bobo67bobo3bobo$104bo5bo67bo2bo3bo2bo$
181bo3bo$178bobo5bobo$170bo8bo7bo$169bo$169b3o8$136bo$135b3o13bo$114bo
20bob2o11b3o5bo$101bo5bo4bobo21b3o10b2obo5bobo18b2o5b2o$100b3o3b3o4b2o
21b2o11b3o6b2o19b2o5b2o$99b2ob2ob2ob2o40b2o$98b3o7b3o2$100bo7bo3$169b
2o$169b2o$125bo$126bo28b2o$124b3o27bobo13b2o$153b2obo13b2o$154b2o$100b
2o5b2o46bo$100b2o5b2o$155bo$154b2o$145b2o6b2obo13b2o$136bo8b2o7bobo13b
2o$135b3o17b2o$134b2obo$117b2o15b3o32b2o$117b2o16b2o32b2o$119bo2bo$
117b3o3bo3bo$116bob3o7bo$116b2obo4b2o2bo$119b2o5b2o$119b2o3b3o$150b2o
5b2o$119b2o3b3o23b2o5b2o$119b2o5b2o$116b2obo4b2o2bo12b2o$116bob3o7bo
12b2o$117b3o3bo3bo$119bo2bo$117b2o$117b2o7$129b2o5b2o$129b2o5b2o!


Edit 2: Okay, this at least makes the gliderless helix that advances at 18c/59. I couldn't find any reactions that would coax a glider out, but I was only working by hand with LWSS.

x = 285, y = 576, rule = B3/S23
148b3o$148bo2bo$143b2o3bo$142bobo3bo$144bo4bobo6$150bo6bo$135bo13b3o4b
3o$134b3o11b2obo4bob2o$134bob2o10b3o6b3o$135b3o11b2o6b2o$135b2o7$126b
3o4b3o22b3o$125bo2bo4bo2bo11b3o6bo2bo$128bo4bo13bo2bo9bo$128bo4bo16bo
9bo$125bobo6bobo13bo6bobo$147bobo6$125bo24bo6bo$124b3o8bo13b3o4b3o$
123b2obo7b3o12bob2o2b2obo$123b3o7b2obo13b3o2b3o$124b2o7b3o14b2o4b2o$
134b2o7$126b3o4b3o22b3o$126bo2bo2bo2bo12b3o7bo2bo$126bo8bo12bo2bo6bo$
126bo8bo12bo9bo$127bobo2bobo13bo10bobo$149bobo6$125bo24bo6bo$124b3o8bo
13b3o4b3o$124bob2o6b3o11b2obo4bob2o$125b3o6bob2o10b3o6b3o$125b2o8b3o
11b2o6b2o$135b2o7$126b3o4b3o22b3o$125bo2bo4bo2bo11b3o6bo2bo$128bo4bo
13bo2bo9bo$128bo4bo16bo9bo$125bobo6bobo13bo6bobo$147bobo6$125bo24bo6bo
$31b2o91b3o8bo13b3o4b3o$31bo91b2obo7b3o12bob2o2b2obo$29bobo91b3o7b2obo
13b3o2b3o$15b2o12b2o93b2o7b3o14b2o4b2o$14bo2bo116b2o$9bo4bo2b2o$6bo3bo
3bo2bo$4b7o5bo$3bo$4b7o5bo$6bo3bo3bo2bo$9bo4bo2b2o25b2obo78b3o4b3o22b
3o$14bo2bo21b3o2b2o2bo77bo2bo2bo2bo12b3o7bo2bo$15b2o23b2o6bo77bo8bo12b
o2bo6bo$41b3o3b4o75bo8bo12bo9bo$42bo3bo3b3o74bobo2bobo13bo10bobo$53bo
95bobo$42bo3bo3b3o$25b2o14b3o3b4o$25bo14b2o6bo$27bo11b3o2b2o2bo$24bo3b
o15b2obo$24b2o2b2o95bo24bo6bo$25bo98b3o8bo13b3o4b3o$26bob4o92bob2o6b3o
11b2obo4bob2o$25bo3b3o93b3o6bob2o10b3o6b3o$26bo2bo95b2o8b3o11b2o6b2o$
27b3o105b2o$28bo$18bo3b3o$3b2o12bobo2b5o$3b2o12bo3b2o3b2o$18bo2bo3b2o$
19b3o3bo9bo$34bobo89b3o4b3o22b3o91b2o$19b3o3bo9b2o88bo2bo4bo2bo11b3o6b
o2bo92bo$18bo2bo3b2o101bo4bo13bo2bo9bo92bobo$3b2o12bo3b2o3b2o42b2o44b
2o10bo4bo16bo9bo93b2o$3b2o12bobo2b5o41bo4bo40bo4bo5bobo6bobo13bo6bobo
107b4o$18bo3b3o21b6o22bo17b6o22bo26bobo117bob2o5bo$45bo5bo16bo5bo16bo
5bo15b2o5bo146bo6b2o2bo$51bo17b6o22bo16bo2b4o147b2o5b6o$45bo4bo40bo4bo
15bo2bo165bo$28bo18b2o44b2o16b3obo152b2o5b6o$28bo6b2o78bo151bo6b2o2bo$
5bo2bo22b2o4bo67b3o4bo37bo6bo80b2o2bobo22bob2o5bo$8bo7b3o9bo4bobobo69b
o4bo22bo13b3o4b3o78b3obo3bo21b4o$4bo9bo4bo8bo7bo69bo4bob2o5b3o11b3o12b
ob2o2b2obo77b2o6bo$4b2o8bo5bo12bo38b2o5b2o29b3o9bo10b2obo13b3o2b3o76bo
2bob5o$10bo8bo10b3o39b2o5b2o30b2o8bo11b3o14b2o4b2o74b3o3b3o$7b2o8b2o
115b2o95bo$232b3o3b3o$7b2o8b2o215bo2bob5o14b2o$10bo8bo53bo5bo21b2o133b
2o6bo8bo5bo$4b2o8bo5bo51b3o3b3o19bobo134b3obo3bo7bo4bo$4bo9bo4bo17b2o
14b2o16b2o2bobo2b2o20bo135b2o2bobo12b3o$8bo7b3o17b2o15b2o16b2ob2ob2ob
2o12b2o158bob2ob2o$5bo2bo28b5o32b2ob2o14bobo30b3o4b3o22b3o95bo$38b4o
30bobo3bobo14bo13b2o15bo2bo2bo2bo12b3o7bo2bo91bo2b3o$71bo2bo3bo2bo26bo
bo15bo8bo12bo2bo6bo94b2o2b2o$38b4o32bo3bo31bo15bo8bo12bo9bo96bo2bo$37b
5o29bobo5bobo45bobo2bobo13bo10bobo93b3o$36b2o15b2o17bo7bo68bobo$37b2o
14b2o204bob2o$27b2o229bo2b2o2b3o12b2o$26bobo60b3o166bo6b2o13b2o$26bo
64bo166b2o3b3o$25b2o63bo158bo10bo3bo$82b3o65bo6bo90bobo$84bo50bo13b3o
4b3o89b2o10bo3bo$58b2o23bo13b3o34b3o11b2obo4bob2o98b2o3b3o$41b2o15bobo
38bo7bo26bob2o10b3o6b3o98bo6b2o13b2o$41b2o15bob2o36bo8bo2b2o23b3o11b2o
6b2o7b4o42b4o42bo2b2o2b3o12b2o$59b2o45bo5bo5b2o15b2o28b6o17b2o21b6o17b
2o23bob2o$59bo47bobo2b2o4b2o44b2ob4o16b2ob4o16b2ob4o16b2ob4o$107bo3b2o
52b2o5bo15b6o17b2o21b6o$59bo18b2o29b3o57bo4bo14b4o42b4o$59b2o16bobo89b
4obo80bo$41b2o15bob2o6b2o9bo29b3o59bo77bo6b2o$41b2o15bobo7b2o37bo3b2o
57b2o6b2o68b2o27b2o$58b2o47bobo2b2o4b2o6b3o4b3o34b2o5b2o68b3ob4o12b2o
7b4o$106bo5bo5b2o5bo2bo4bo2bo11b3o12b2o6bo2bo4bo71b7o7b2o2bo6bobobo$
107bo2b2o16bo4bo13bo2bo11b2o8b2o30b2o5b2o38b5o9b6o4b3ob2o$107bo20bo4bo
16bo13bo8bo30b2o5b2o52b4o5bob2o$88b2o35bobo6bobo13bo123bob2o$88b2o57bo
bo$274bob2o$183bo81b4o5bob2o$66b3o113b2o20b3o3b3o29bo3bo18b6o4b3ob2o$
68bo113bobo19bo2bobo2bo17b2o9bo5bo17b2o2bo6bobobo$67bo122bo12bo3bobo3b
o16b2o15bo19b2o7b4o$150bo6bo31b2o13bo2bobo2bo29bo3b2o29b2o$135bo13b3o
4b3o16bo13bobo14bo3bo32b3o$89bo5bo38b3o12bob2o2b2obo15b2o28b2o5b2o$88b
3o3b3o36b2obo13b3o2b3o16bobo26b3o5b3o29b3o$87b2obo3bob2o35b3o14b2o4b2o
45b3o5b3o28bo3b2o$134b2o94b2o15bo$230b2o9bo5bo$28b2o9b2o49bo3bo147bo3b
o9b2o$28b2o8b2o15b2o33bo3bo99b2o60bobo$39b5o10bobo136b2o63bo$40b4o12bo
7b3o8b2o118bo62b2o$62bo3bo8b2o124b2o$40b4o17bo4bo59b3o4b3o64b2o$39b5o
17bo3bo60bo2bo2bo2bo12b3o35b2o14bo22b2o$28b2o8b2o86bo8bo12bo2bo23b2o8b
2o37bobo15b2o$28b2o9b2o20bo3bo60bo8bo12bo24b5o9bo36bo17b2o$61bo4bo60bo
bo2bobo13bo16b2o5bo4bo46b3o$62bo3bo8b2o72bobo13b2o5bo2b3o$64b3o8b2o95b
2o2bo$174b2o30bo$88b2o5b2o108b2o17b3o$88b2o5b2o77b2o29bobo7b2o7bo17b2o
$172b2o2bo38b2o7bobo15b2o$150bo6bo7b2o5bo2b3o47b2o$135bo13b3o4b3o6b2o
5bo4bo$134b3o11b2obo4bob2o13b5o$33b2o99bob2o10b3o6b3o15b2o$33bo101b3o
11b2o6b2o36b2o$19b2o10bobo101b2o58b2o$18bo12b2o$17bo2b2o$17bo2bo7bo
188b2o$8bo8bobo7bo188b2o$6b3o9b2o7b2o189bo$5bo21b2ob2o$6b3o9b2o7b2o2bo
94b3o4b3o$8bo8bobo8bob2o93bo2bo4bo2bo11b3o$17bo2bo6bo2bob2o94bo4bo13bo
2bo37b3o3b3o$17bo2b2o5b3ob3o4b4o86bo4bo16bo37bo2bobo2bo$18bo12b3o4b2ob
o83bobo6bobo13bo37bo7bo$19b2o10bobo7bo10bo94bobo90bo3bo$32bo6b2o11b3o
134bo5bo43bo5bo9b2o$55bo134b2ob2o34bo15bo9b2o$32b2o5b2o11b3o173b2o10bo
3b2o$30b2obo7bo10bo155b2o9b2o7bobo10b3o$30bo7b2obo166b2o8b2o$30b3o5b4o
108bo6bo61b5o17b3o$135bo13b3o4b3o61b4o16bo3b2o$134b3o12bob2o2b2obo86bo
9b2o$133b2obo13b3o2b3o62b4o15bo5bo9b2o$133b3o14b2o4b2o61b5o16bo3bo$
134b2o72b2o8b2o$208b2o9b2o2$188b2o5b2o$6b4o7b2o169b2o5b2o$5bo3bo6bo2bo
$5bo10bo2b2o$6bob2obo4bo2bo106b3o4b3o$9b3o6bo18bo88bo2bo2bo2bo12b3o$
36bobo87bo8bo12bo2bo98b2o$9b3o6bo18b2o87bo8bo12bo102bo$6bob2obo4bo2bo
107bobo2bobo13bo102bobo10bo$5bo10bo2b2o128bobo100b2o10b2o$5bo3bo6bo2bo
19b4o42b4o173bob3o$6b4o7b2o19b6o21b2o17b6o21b2o142b2o9b2o$38b4ob2o16b
4ob2o16b4ob2o16b4ob2o143bo7b2o9bo$42b2o17b6o21b2o17b6o141bobo8bo10b3o$
62b4o42b4o142bobo22bo$150bo6bo95bo2bo8bo10b3o$135bo13b3o4b3o94b2obo8b
2o9bo$31bo102b3o11b2obo4bob2o90bo3bob2o8b2o$18bo3bo7b3o5b2o70bo23bob2o
10b3o6b3o83b2o2bo3b2o2b2o5bob3o$6b2o9bo5bo5b2obo5b2o70b2o23b3o11b2o6b
2o84bob2o5bo11b2o$6b2o9bo11b3o42b2o5b2o26bobo23b2o95bo11bo8bo10bo$17b
2o3bo7bobo41b2o5b2o20bo126b3o11b3o4b2o$19b3o7bob2o70b2o124bo$29b2o71bo
bo13bo111b3o11b3o4b2o$19b3o6bob2o86b2o112bo11bo6bobo$17b2o3bo4b2o4b2o
82bobo123bob2o6b2o$6b2o9bo12bo14b2o196b2o2bo4b2o$6b2o9bo5bo5bo5bo9bobo
7b2o76b3o$18bo3bo7bo14bob2o6b2o76bo2bo11b3o$30bobobo11b2o85bo13bo2bo$
29b6o11bo51b2o33bo16bo$29bobo67b2o33bobo13bo$30bo15bo51bo48bobo$46b2o
43b2o$45bob2o6b2o17b2o5b2o9b2o$45bobo7b2o17bob2ob2obo8bo14b2o$29b2o14b
2o28bobobobo25b2o156b4o5b6o$28bobo44bobobobo24bo158bob2o7b4o$28bo45bo
7bo67bo6bo107bo7bob2o$27b2o106bo13b3o4b3o88bo18b2o5b2o$134b3o12bob2o2b
2obo87bobo$55bo8b2o3bobo15bo45b2obo13b3o2b3o88b2o18b2o5b2o$51b2o2bo7bo
2bobo3bo3b2ob2o6b2o44b3o14b2o4b2o107bo7bob2o$43b2o5bo5bo5bo9bo2bobobo
2bo3bobo45b2o39b2o44b2o42bob2o7b4o$43b2o4b2o2bobo5b2o9bo3bo3b3o17b3o3b
o66bo4bo40bo4bo40b4o5b6o$50b2o3bo6bo18bo16b5o2bobo12b2o50bo22b6o17bo
22b6o$51b3o9bo2bobo2bo25b2o3b2o3bo12b2o50bo5bo16bo5bo16bo5bo16bo5bo$
64b2o3b2o27b2o3bo2bo65b6o17bo22b6o17bo$51b3o45bo3b3o90bo4bo40bo4bo$50b
2o3bo142b2o44b2o$43b2o4b2o2bobo14b2o27bo3b3o27b3o$43b2o5bo5bo13b2o26b
2o3bo2bo25bo2bo12b3o113bo$51b2o2bo41b2o3b2o3bo12b2o13bo12bo2bo93b2o5b
3o7bo2bo$55bo19b2o21b5o2bobo12b2o13bo12bo24b3o69b2o4bo2bo7b5o10b2o$76b
2o20bob3o3bo25bobo13bo24bo28b2o5b2o43bo7b3ob2o9b2o$75bo20b2o51bobo22bo
27b2o5b2o40bo2bo8b2obo$90b2o4b3o81b3o69b2o10b2o$90b2o3bo3bo80bo73b2o$
94bo5bo64b3o13bo72bobo7b2o$95b2ob2o65bo84b2obo3bo5b2obo$166bo71b2o10bo
b3obo5b3ob2o9b2o$95b2ob2o50bo77b2o7bobo9b5o8b5o10b2o$94bo5bo34bo13b3o
76b2o7bo12bo3bo7bo2bo$95bo3bo34b3o11b2obo85b3o10b3obo9bo$64bo31b3o35bo
b2o10b3o34b2o64bo2b2o$64b2o30b3o36b3o11b2o34bobo67bo$63bobo69b2o48bo
67b2o$192b2o43b3o$192bobo7b2o5b2o17b2o7bo$47b2o128b2o13bo8bo2bo3bo2bo
16b2o7bobo$30b2o15bobo127bobo24b2ob2o29b2o14b2o$30b2o15bob2o126bo25bob
obobo44bobo$48b2o10b2o27b2o7b2o103bobobobo46bo$48bo9b2ob2o14b2o10bob2o
3b2obo33b3o65bo9bo44b2o$58bo2bo15b2o10bo3bobo3bo33bo2bo11b3o49bo11bo$
48bo9bo2bo27b2o2bobo2b2o33bo13bo2bo64bo3bo10b2o$48b2o9b2o29b3o3b3o34bo
16bo45b3o5b2ob2o3bobobobob2o7b5o$30b2o15bob2o40bo5bo36bobo13bo45bo5bo
2bobo3bob3o3b2obo6bo4bo5b2o$30b2o15bobo9b2o86bobo32b2obo11bo4b3o3b2o4b
o5bo2bo5b3o2bo5b2o$47b2o9bo2bo101b2o12b3o2b2o2bo25bob2o3b2obo7bo2b2o$
58bo2bo15b2o84b2o13b2o6bo26b2obobob2o9b2o$58b2ob2o14b2o100b3o3b2o28bo
3bo$60b2o118bo3bo46b2o$90b2o5b2o131bo2b2o$90b2o5b2o51bo29bo3bo28b2o14b
3o2bo5b2o$135bo13b3o27b3o3b2o26b2o14bo4bo5b2o$134b3o12bob2o10b2o13b2o
6bo42b5o$133b2obo13b3o10b2o12b3o2b2o2bo21b2o20b2o$133b3o14b2o30b2obo
22bobo$134b2o51bo20bo$186b3o4b2o$185bo3bo3b2o$185b2ob2o$185b2ob2o2$40b
2o143b2ob2o$40bo92b3o49b2ob2o$20bo17bobo91bo2bo12b3o34bo3bo$21bo3bo12b
2o95bo12bo2bo34b3o$18bo7bo108bo12bo38bo31b3o$16bo5b2o2bo105bobo13bo70b
o$15bob2o5b2o123bobo68bo$13b3ob2o3b3o$12bo223b2o$13b3ob2o3b3o210bobo
15b2o$15bob2o5b2o24bo184bo17b2o$16bo5b2o2bo23bo2b2o131bo7bo28b2o10b3o$
18bo7bo22bo5bo94bo34b4o3b4o10b2o15bobo$21bo3bo24bobo2b2o78bo13b3o33bo
3bobo3bo10b2o15bob2o$20bo29bo3b2o3bo74b3o11b2obo34bo2bobo2bo29b2o$52b
3o4b3o72bob2o10b3o35b3o3b3o29bo10b3o$62bo72b3o11b2o84bo17b2o$52b3o4b3o
73b2o87bo10bobo15b2o$34b2o14bo3b2o3bo164b2o10b2o$34bobo3bo9bobo2b2o
149b2o15bob2o$40bo8bo5bo150b2o15bobo$34bo5bo9bo2b2o168b2o$34b2o14bo
135b2o5b2o$35b5o146b2o5b2o$36bo2bo93b3o$36bo2bo93bo2bo11b3o$36b3o94bo
13bo2bo$133bo16bo$134bobo13bo$27b2o3bo114bobo$12b2o13b3obob2o$12b2o13b
3o4bo$30bo3bo$31b3o10bo$43bobo197b2o$31b3o10b2o104bo93bo$30bo3bo100bo
13b3o92bobo$12b2o13b3o4bo99b3o12bob2o92b2o12bo3b3o$12b2o13b3obob2o19b
4o42b4o29b2obo13b3o105bobo2b5o$27b2o3bo4b2o14b6o21b2o17b6o21b2o5b3o14b
2o106bo3b2o$53b4ob2o16b4ob2o16b4ob2o16b4ob2o5b2o123bo2bo3b2obo$57b2o
17b6o21b2o17b6o132b3o3b2ob3o$77b4o37bo4b4o145bo$37b2o79b4o138b3o3b2ob
3o$39bobo78b3o109b2o25bo2bo3b2obo$36bo2b7o68bo8bo106b5o23bo3b2o$36b2ob
6obo67b2o3b4o106bo4bo23bobo2b5o$13b6o5b4o10bo7bo66bobo3b3o7bo99bo2b3o
24bo3b3o$13b4o7b2obo53b2o5b2o30bo8b2o17b3o74bo3b2o2bo$16b2obo7bo53b2o
5b2o38bobo17bo2bo71b3o5b2o$18b2o5b2o121bo73bo$148bo74b3o5b2o$18b2o5b2o
122bobo73bo3b2o2bo15b2o$16b2obo7bo21b2o178bo2b3o13bobo$13b4o7b2obo20bo
60b2o118bo4bo8b3o2bo$13b6o5b4o19bo2b2o10b2o17b3o3b3o20b2o118b5o15bo$
47bo2bo11b2o16bo2bo3bo2bo18bo122b2o15b2o$47bobo30bo3bobo3bo11b2o142b2o
$48b2o29b2obobobobob2o11b2o45bo94b2obo$79b2ob2o3b2ob2o10bo14b2o16bo13b
3o94b3o$48b2o30b3o5b3o27b2o14b3o11b2obo95bo$47bobo67bo16bob2o10b3o$47b
o2bo11b2o71b3o11b2o105bo$47bo2b2o10b2o71b2o115b2o2bo$36b2o10bo202bo5bo
13b2o$35bobo11b2o47bo151b2o2bobo14b2o$35bo62b2o151b2o3bo$34b2o61bobo
140bo11b3o$91bo147bobo$91b2o146b2o11b3o$90bobo13bo144b2o3bo$50b2o14b3o
37b2o40b3o9b2o44b2o42b2o2bobo14b2o$50b2o12bo3bo36bobo9b2o28bo2bo7bo4bo
40bo4bo36bo4bo5bo13b2o$63bo4bo47b2ob2o6b2o21bo6bo22b6o17bo22b6o15bo4b
2o2bo$63bo3bo49bo2bo6b2o21bo6bo5bo16bo5bo16bo5bo16bo5bo13bo9bo$117bo2b
o26bobo7b6o17bo22b6o17bo$63bo3bo50b2o46bo14bo4bo40bo4bo$63bo4bo17b2o
77bobo15b2o44b2o15b2o$50b2o12bo3bo8b2o8b2o29b2o42b3o81b2o$50b2o14b3o8b
2o7bo30bo2bo40bo80b3o2b2o$106bo10bo2bo6b2o33bo3bo2b3o66b4o3bobo$105bob
o8b2ob2o6b2o34b3o3bo68b2o6bo10b2o2bo4b2o2b2o$117b2o16bo18b3o13bo24b2o
5b2o53bob2o6b2ob2o$134b3o17bo40b2o5b2o39b2o13bo6bobo$97b2o34b2obo18bo
102b3o4b2o$97b2o34b3o$134b2o122b3o4b2o$234bo23bo6bobo$75bo98b2o58b2o
21bob2o6b2ob2o$75b2o97bobo19bo5bo18b2o9bob3o20b2o2bo4b2o2b2o$74bobo97b
o20b3o3b3o17b2o13b2o$181b2o11b2o2bobo2b2o30b2o$181bobo10bo3bobo3bo30bo
$166b2o13bo12bob2o3b2obo$148b3o15bobo25b2o7b2o30bo$97b3o3b3o42bo2bo14b
o68b2o$51b2o43bo2bo3bo2bo41bo72b2o13b2o$50bo49bobo45bo72b2o9bob3o$37b
2o10bo2b2o46bobo46bobo82b2o11b2o$37b2o10bo2bo18bo28bobo131bo12bobo$49b
obo11b2o4bo2bo23bo2bo3bo2bo78b3o61bo$50b2o12b2o3b5o10b2o11bo7bo79bo63b
2o$63bo5b3ob2o9b2o100bo$50b2o18b2obo118b3o$49bobo19b2o119bo9b2o$37b2o
10bo2bo82bo41b3o13bo23b2o14b2o$37b2o10bo2b2o17b2o61b3o29b2o9bo38b2o15b
2o$50bo19b2obo60bob2o18b2o7bobo10bo38b5o$51b2o16b3ob2o9b2o49b3o18b2o6b
2obo13b2o35b4o$69b5o10b2o49b2o28b2o$69bo2bo93bo51b4o$71bo25b2o5b2o91b
2o18b5o$97b2o5b2o60bo30bobo6b2o8b2o15b2o$165b2o30bo8b2o9b2o14b2o$156b
2o6b2obo10bo$156b2o7bobo9bobo$166b2o9bobo$148b3o$147bo2bo35b2o$150bo
35b2o$150bo$147bobo2$208b3o$208bo$209bo3$135bo$134b3o43bo5bo$133b2obo
42b3o3b3o44bo$133b3o42b2o2bobo2b2o43b2o$134b2o41bob4ob4obo40bob3o11b2o
$179b3o3b3o25b2o19b2o10b2o$178b3o5b3o23bo7b2o11b2o$199b2o10bo2b2o4bobo
10bo$199b2o10bo2bo5bo$211bobo19bo$102b2o5b2o101b2o19b2o$102b2o5b2o123b
2o10b2o$148b3o61b2o16bob3o11b2o$148bo2bo59bobo18b2o$148bo50b2o10bo2bo
17bo$148bo50b2o10bo2b2o$149bobo60bo$179b2o5b2o25b2o$103bo5bo69b2o5b2o$
102b3o3b3o$101bo2b2ob2o2bo$101b3o5b3o2$135bo$134b3o$134bob2o$135b3o$
135b2o8$148b3o$147bo2bo$109bo40bo$110bo39bo$108b3o36bobo5$174b2o5b2o$
174b2o5b2o$99bo7bo27bo$98b4o3b4o25b3o$98bo3bobo3bo24b2obo$99bo2bobo2bo
13bo11b3o$99b3o3b3o11bobo12b2o$120b2o2$174b3o3b3o$173bo2bo3bo2bo$173b
2obo3bob2o2$99b2o5b2o$99b2o5b2o40b3o$148bo2bo$132bo15bo$133bo14bo$131b
3o15bobo3$116b2o$116b2o2$125bo3bo5bob2o$115b2o7bo5bo4bobobo$115b2o7bo
9bo4bo$124b2o3bo5bobobo36bo$126b3o6bob2o35b2o$175b2o$126b3o$124b2o3bo$
115b2o7bo15b2o$115b2o7bo5bo9b2o$125bo3bo2$116b2o$116b2o30b3o25b3o5b3o$
147bo2bo25bo2b2ob2o2bo$150bo12bobo11b3o3b3o$150bo12b2o13bo5bo$147bobo
14bo3$128b2o5b2o$128b2o5b2o2$177b2o5b2o$177b2o5b2o2$153bo$151b2o$152b
2o3$167b2o$167b2o$157bo$147b2o6bo2bo$145bob3o5b5o8b2o$143b3o4bo4b3ob2o
7b2o$145bob3o6b2obo$147b2o8b2o2$157b2o$156b2obo$143b2o10b3ob2o7b2o$
143b2o10b5o8b2o$155bo2bo$157bo$167b2o$167b2o7$148b2o5b2o$148b2o5b2o!
Physics: sophistication from simplicity.
User avatar
biggiemac
 
Posts: 504
Joined: September 17th, 2014, 12:21 am
Location: California, USA

Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby biggiemac » December 31st, 2014, 5:53 am

So.. somewhere I was mistaken with math. The 18c/59 helix doesn't support H climbers, instead it matches the NE rakes of the waterbear.
x = 729, y = 745, rule = B3/S23
7$17bo$17b2o$16bobo2$31b3o$13b2o18bo$12bobo17bo$14bo31b2o$28bo18b2o$
28b2o16bo$27bobo31b2o$60bobo$42b3o17bo$44bo31bo$43bo32b2o$57b2o16bobo$
58b2o$57bo32b3o$72b2o18bo$71bobo17bo$73bo31b2o$87bo18b2o$87b2o16bo$86b
obo31b2o$119bobo$101b3o17bo$103bo31bo$102bo32b2o$116b2o16bobo$117b2o$
116bo32b3o$131b2o18bo$130bobo17bo$132bo31b2o$146bo18b2o$146b2o16bo$
145bobo31b2o$178bobo$160b3o17bo$162bo31bo$161bo32b2o$175b2o16bobo$176b
2o$175bo32b3o$190b2o18bo$189bobo17bo$191bo31b2o$205bo18b2o$205b2o16bo$
204bobo31b2o$237bobo$219b3o17bo$221bo31bo$220bo32b2o$234b2o16bobo$235b
2o$234bo32b3o$249b2o18bo$248bobo17bo$250bo31b2o$264bo18b2o$264b2o16bo$
263bobo31b2o$296bobo$278b3o17bo$280bo31bo$279bo32b2o$293b2o16bobo$294b
2o$293bo32b3o$308b2o18bo$307bobo17bo$309bo31b2o$323bo18b2o$323b2o16bo$
322bobo31b2o$355bobo$337b3o17bo$339bo31bo$338bo32b2o$352b2o16bobo$353b
2o$352bo32b3o$367b2o18bo$366bobo17bo$368bo31b2o$382bo18b2o$382b2o16bo$
381bobo31b2o$414bobo$396b3o17bo$398bo31bo$397bo32b2o$411b2o16bobo$412b
2o$411bo32b3o$426b2o18bo$425bobo17bo$427bo31b2o$441bo18b2o$441b2o16bo$
440bobo31b2o$473bobo$455b3o17bo$457bo31bo$456bo32b2o$470b2o16bobo$471b
2o$470bo32b3o$485b2o18bo$484bobo17bo$486bo31b2o$500bo18b2o$500b2o16bo$
499bobo31b2o$532bobo$514b3o17bo$516bo31bo$515bo32b2o$529b2o16bobo$530b
2o$529bo32b3o$544b2o18bo$543bobo17bo$545bo31b2o$559bo18b2o$559b2o16bo$
558bobo31b2o$591bobo$573b3o17bo$575bo31bo$574bo32b2o$588b2o16bobo$589b
2o$588bo$603b2o$602bobo$604bo15$577b3o$577bo2bo$572b2o3bo$571bobo3bo$
573bo4bobo6$579bo6bo$564bo13b3o4b3o$563b3o11b2obo4bob2o$563bob2o10b3o
6b3o$564b3o11b2o6b2o$564b2o7$555b3o4b3o22b3o$554bo2bo4bo2bo11b3o6bo2bo
$557bo4bo13bo2bo9bo$557bo4bo16bo9bo$554bobo6bobo13bo6bobo$576bobo6$
554bo24bo6bo$553b3o8bo13b3o4b3o$552b2obo7b3o12bob2o2b2obo$552b3o7b2obo
13b3o2b3o$553b2o7b3o14b2o4b2o$563b2o7$555b3o4b3o22b3o$555bo2bo2bo2bo
12b3o7bo2bo$555bo8bo12bo2bo6bo$555bo8bo12bo9bo$556bobo2bobo13bo10bobo$
578bobo6$554bo24bo6bo$553b3o8bo13b3o4b3o$553bob2o6b3o11b2obo4bob2o$
554b3o6bob2o10b3o6b3o$554b2o8b3o11b2o6b2o$564b2o7$555b3o4b3o22b3o$554b
o2bo4bo2bo11b3o6bo2bo$557bo4bo13bo2bo9bo$557bo4bo16bo9bo$554bobo6bobo
13bo6bobo$576bobo6$554bo24bo6bo$460b2o91b3o8bo13b3o4b3o$460bo91b2obo7b
3o12bob2o2b2obo$458bobo91b3o7b2obo13b3o2b3o$444b2o12b2o93b2o7b3o14b2o
4b2o$443bo2bo116b2o$438bo4bo2b2o$435bo3bo3bo2bo$433b7o5bo$432bo$433b7o
5bo$435bo3bo3bo2bo$438bo4bo2b2o25b2obo78b3o4b3o22b3o$443bo2bo21b3o2b2o
2bo77bo2bo2bo2bo12b3o7bo2bo$444b2o23b2o6bo77bo8bo12bo2bo6bo$470b3o3b4o
75bo8bo12bo9bo$471bo3bo3b3o74bobo2bobo13bo10bobo$482bo95bobo$471bo3bo
3b3o$454b2o14b3o3b4o$454bo14b2o6bo$456bo11b3o2b2o2bo$453bo3bo15b2obo$
453b2o2b2o95bo24bo6bo$454bo98b3o8bo13b3o4b3o$455bob4o92bob2o6b3o11b2ob
o4bob2o$454bo3b3o93b3o6bob2o10b3o6b3o$455bo2bo95b2o8b3o11b2o6b2o$456b
3o105b2o$457bo$447bo3b3o$432b2o12bobo2b5o$432b2o12bo3b2o3b2o$447bo2bo
3b2o$448b3o3bo9bo$463bobo89b3o4b3o22b3o91b2o$448b3o3bo9b2o88bo2bo4bo2b
o11b3o6bo2bo92bo$447bo2bo3b2o101bo4bo13bo2bo9bo92bobo$432b2o12bo3b2o3b
2o42b2o44b2o10bo4bo16bo9bo93b2o$432b2o12bobo2b5o41bo4bo40bo4bo5bobo6bo
bo13bo6bobo107b4o$447bo3b3o21b6o22bo17b6o22bo26bobo117bob2o5bo$474bo5b
o16bo5bo16bo5bo15b2o5bo146bo6b2o2bo$480bo17b6o22bo16bo2b4o147b2o5b6o$
474bo4bo40bo4bo15bo2bo165bo$457bo18b2o44b2o16b3obo152b2o5b6o$457bo6b2o
78bo151bo6b2o2bo$434bo2bo22b2o4bo67b3o4bo37bo6bo80b2o2bobo22bob2o5bo$
437bo7b3o9bo4bobobo69bo4bo22bo13b3o4b3o78b3obo3bo21b4o$433bo9bo4bo8bo
7bo69bo4bob2o5b3o11b3o12bob2o2b2obo77b2o6bo$433b2o8bo5bo12bo38b2o5b2o
29b3o9bo10b2obo13b3o2b3o76bo2bob5o$439bo8bo10b3o39b2o5b2o30b2o8bo11b3o
14b2o4b2o74b3o3b3o$436b2o8b2o115b2o95bo$661b3o3b3o$436b2o8b2o215bo2bob
5o14b2o$439bo8bo53bo5bo21b2o133b2o6bo8bo5bo$433b2o8bo5bo51b3o3b3o19bob
o134b3obo3bo7bo4bo$433bo9bo4bo17b2o14b2o16b2o2bobo2b2o20bo135b2o2bobo
12b3o$437bo7b3o17b2o15b2o16b2ob2ob2ob2o12b2o158bob2ob2o$434bo2bo28b5o
32b2ob2o14bobo30b3o4b3o22b3o95bo$467b4o30bobo3bobo14bo13b2o15bo2bo2bo
2bo12b3o7bo2bo91bo2b3o$500bo2bo3bo2bo26bobo15bo8bo12bo2bo6bo94b2o2b2o$
467b4o32bo3bo31bo15bo8bo12bo9bo96bo2bo$466b5o29bobo5bobo45bobo2bobo13b
o10bobo93b3o$465b2o15b2o17bo7bo68bobo$466b2o14b2o204bob2o$456b2o229bo
2b2o2b3o12b2o$455bobo60b3o166bo6b2o13b2o$455bo64bo166b2o3b3o$454b2o63b
o158bo10bo3bo$511b3o65bo6bo90bobo$513bo50bo13b3o4b3o89b2o10bo3bo$487b
2o23bo13b3o34b3o11b2obo4bob2o98b2o3b3o$470b2o15bobo38bo7bo26bob2o10b3o
6b3o98bo6b2o13b2o$470b2o15bob2o36bo8bo2b2o23b3o11b2o6b2o7b4o42b4o42bo
2b2o2b3o12b2o$488b2o45bo5bo5b2o15b2o28b6o17b2o21b6o17b2o23bob2o$488bo
47bobo2b2o4b2o44b2ob4o16b2ob4o16b2ob4o16b2ob4o$536bo3b2o52b2o5bo15b6o
17b2o21b6o$488bo18b2o29b3o57bo4bo14b4o42b4o$488b2o16bobo89b4obo80bo$
470b2o15bob2o6b2o9bo29b3o59bo77bo6b2o$470b2o15bobo7b2o37bo3b2o57b2o6b
2o68b2o27b2o$487b2o47bobo2b2o4b2o6b3o4b3o34b2o5b2o68b3ob4o12b2o7b4o$
535bo5bo5b2o5bo2bo4bo2bo11b3o12b2o6bo2bo4bo71b7o7b2o2bo6bobobo$536bo2b
2o16bo4bo13bo2bo11b2o8b2o30b2o5b2o38b5o9b6o4b3ob2o$536bo20bo4bo16bo13b
o8bo30b2o5b2o52b4o5bob2o$517b2o35bobo6bobo13bo123bob2o$517b2o57bobo$
703bob2o$612bo81b4o5bob2o$495b3o113b2o20b3o3b3o29bo3bo18b6o4b3ob2o$
497bo113bobo19bo2bobo2bo17b2o9bo5bo17b2o2bo6bobobo$496bo122bo12bo3bobo
3bo16b2o15bo19b2o7b4o$579bo6bo31b2o13bo2bobo2bo29bo3b2o29b2o$564bo13b
3o4b3o16bo13bobo14bo3bo32b3o$518bo5bo38b3o12bob2o2b2obo15b2o28b2o5b2o$
517b3o3b3o36b2obo13b3o2b3o16bobo26b3o5b3o29b3o$516b2obo3bob2o35b3o14b
2o4b2o45b3o5b3o28bo3b2o$563b2o94b2o15bo$659b2o9bo5bo$457b2o9b2o49bo3bo
147bo3bo9b2o$457b2o8b2o15b2o33bo3bo99b2o60bobo$468b5o10bobo136b2o63bo$
469b4o12bo7b3o8b2o118bo62b2o$491bo3bo8b2o124b2o$469b4o17bo4bo59b3o4b3o
64b2o$468b5o17bo3bo60bo2bo2bo2bo12b3o35b2o14bo22b2o$457b2o8b2o86bo8bo
12bo2bo23b2o8b2o37bobo15b2o$457b2o9b2o20bo3bo60bo8bo12bo24b5o9bo36bo
17b2o$490bo4bo60bobo2bobo13bo16b2o5bo4bo46b3o$491bo3bo8b2o72bobo13b2o
5bo2b3o$493b3o8b2o95b2o2bo$603b2o30bo$517b2o5b2o108b2o17b3o$517b2o5b2o
77b2o29bobo7b2o7bo17b2o$601b2o2bo38b2o7bobo15b2o$579bo6bo7b2o5bo2b3o
47b2o$564bo13b3o4b3o6b2o5bo4bo$563b3o11b2obo4bob2o13b5o$462b2o99bob2o
10b3o6b3o15b2o$462bo101b3o11b2o6b2o36b2o$448b2o10bobo101b2o58b2o$447bo
12b2o$446bo2b2o$446bo2bo7bo188b2o$437bo8bobo7bo188b2o$435b3o9b2o7b2o
189bo$434bo21b2ob2o$435b3o9b2o7b2o2bo94b3o4b3o$437bo8bobo8bob2o93bo2bo
4bo2bo11b3o$446bo2bo6bo2bob2o94bo4bo13bo2bo37b3o3b3o$446bo2b2o5b3ob3o
4b4o86bo4bo16bo37bo2bobo2bo$447bo12b3o4b2obo83bobo6bobo13bo37bo7bo$
448b2o10bobo7bo10bo94bobo90bo3bo$461bo6b2o11b3o134bo5bo43bo5bo9b2o$
484bo134b2ob2o34bo15bo9b2o$461b2o5b2o11b3o173b2o10bo3b2o$459b2obo7bo
10bo155b2o9b2o7bobo10b3o$459bo7b2obo166b2o8b2o$459b3o5b4o108bo6bo61b5o
17b3o$564bo13b3o4b3o61b4o16bo3b2o$563b3o12bob2o2b2obo86bo9b2o$562b2obo
13b3o2b3o62b4o15bo5bo9b2o$562b3o14b2o4b2o61b5o16bo3bo$563b2o72b2o8b2o$
637b2o9b2o2$617b2o5b2o$435b4o7b2o169b2o5b2o$434bo3bo6bo2bo$434bo10bo2b
2o$435bob2obo4bo2bo106b3o4b3o$438b3o6bo18bo88bo2bo2bo2bo12b3o$465bobo
87bo8bo12bo2bo98b2o$438b3o6bo18b2o87bo8bo12bo102bo$435bob2obo4bo2bo
107bobo2bobo13bo102bobo10bo$434bo10bo2b2o128bobo100b2o10b2o$434bo3bo6b
o2bo19b4o42b4o173bob3o$435b4o7b2o19b6o21b2o17b6o21b2o142b2o9b2o$467b4o
b2o16b4ob2o16b4ob2o16b4ob2o143bo7b2o9bo$471b2o17b6o21b2o17b6o141bobo8b
o10b3o$491b4o42b4o142bobo22bo$579bo6bo95bo2bo8bo10b3o$564bo13b3o4b3o
94b2obo8b2o9bo$460bo102b3o11b2obo4bob2o90bo3bob2o8b2o$447bo3bo7b3o5b2o
70bo23bob2o10b3o6b3o83b2o2bo3b2o2b2o5bob3o$435b2o9bo5bo5b2obo5b2o70b2o
23b3o11b2o6b2o84bob2o5bo11b2o$435b2o9bo11b3o42b2o5b2o26bobo23b2o95bo
11bo8bo10bo$446b2o3bo7bobo41b2o5b2o20bo126b3o11b3o4b2o$448b3o7bob2o70b
2o124bo$458b2o71bobo13bo111b3o11b3o4b2o$448b3o6bob2o86b2o112bo11bo6bob
o$446b2o3bo4b2o4b2o82bobo123bob2o6b2o$435b2o9bo12bo14b2o196b2o2bo4b2o$
435b2o9bo5bo5bo5bo9bobo7b2o76b3o$447bo3bo7bo14bob2o6b2o76bo2bo11b3o$
459bobobo11b2o85bo13bo2bo$458b6o11bo51b2o33bo16bo$458bobo67b2o33bobo
13bo$459bo15bo51bo48bobo$475b2o43b2o$474bob2o6b2o17b2o5b2o9b2o$474bobo
7b2o17bob2ob2obo8bo14b2o$458b2o14b2o28bobobobo25b2o156b4o5b6o$457bobo
44bobobobo24bo158bob2o7b4o$457bo45bo7bo67bo6bo107bo7bob2o$456b2o106bo
13b3o4b3o88bo18b2o5b2o$563b3o12bob2o2b2obo87bobo$484bo8b2o3bobo15bo45b
2obo13b3o2b3o88b2o18b2o5b2o$480b2o2bo7bo2bobo3bo3b2ob2o6b2o44b3o14b2o
4b2o107bo7bob2o$472b2o5bo5bo5bo9bo2bobobo2bo3bobo45b2o39b2o44b2o42bob
2o7b4o$472b2o4b2o2bobo5b2o9bo3bo3b3o17b3o3bo66bo4bo40bo4bo40b4o5b6o$
479b2o3bo6bo18bo16b5o2bobo12b2o50bo22b6o17bo22b6o$480b3o9bo2bobo2bo25b
2o3b2o3bo12b2o50bo5bo16bo5bo16bo5bo16bo5bo$493b2o3b2o27b2o3bo2bo65b6o
17bo22b6o17bo$480b3o45bo3b3o90bo4bo40bo4bo$479b2o3bo142b2o44b2o$472b2o
4b2o2bobo14b2o27bo3b3o27b3o$472b2o5bo5bo13b2o26b2o3bo2bo25bo2bo12b3o
113bo$480b2o2bo41b2o3b2o3bo12b2o13bo12bo2bo93b2o5b3o7bo2bo$484bo19b2o
21b5o2bobo12b2o13bo12bo24b3o69b2o4bo2bo7b5o10b2o$505b2o20bob3o3bo25bob
o13bo24bo28b2o5b2o43bo7b3ob2o9b2o$504bo20b2o51bobo22bo27b2o5b2o40bo2bo
8b2obo$519b2o4b3o81b3o69b2o10b2o$519b2o3bo3bo80bo73b2o$523bo5bo64b3o
13bo72bobo7b2o$524b2ob2o65bo84b2obo3bo5b2obo$595bo71b2o10bob3obo5b3ob
2o9b2o$524b2ob2o50bo77b2o7bobo9b5o8b5o10b2o$523bo5bo34bo13b3o76b2o7bo
12bo3bo7bo2bo$524bo3bo34b3o11b2obo85b3o10b3obo9bo$493bo31b3o35bob2o10b
3o34b2o64bo2b2o$493b2o30b3o36b3o11b2o34bobo67bo$492bobo69b2o48bo67b2o$
621b2o43b3o$621bobo7b2o5b2o17b2o7bo$476b2o128b2o13bo8bo2bo3bo2bo16b2o
7bobo$459b2o15bobo127bobo24b2ob2o29b2o14b2o$459b2o15bob2o126bo25bobobo
bo44bobo$477b2o10b2o27b2o7b2o103bobobobo46bo$477bo9b2ob2o14b2o10bob2o
3b2obo33b3o65bo9bo44b2o$487bo2bo15b2o10bo3bobo3bo33bo2bo11b3o49bo11bo$
477bo9bo2bo27b2o2bobo2b2o33bo13bo2bo64bo3bo10b2o$477b2o9b2o29b3o3b3o
34bo16bo45b3o5b2ob2o3bobobobob2o7b5o$459b2o15bob2o40bo5bo36bobo13bo45b
o5bo2bobo3bob3o3b2obo6bo4bo5b2o$459b2o15bobo9b2o86bobo32b2obo11bo4b3o
3b2o4bo5bo2bo5b3o2bo5b2o$476b2o9bo2bo101b2o12b3o2b2o2bo25bob2o3b2obo7b
o2b2o$487bo2bo15b2o84b2o13b2o6bo26b2obobob2o9b2o$487b2ob2o14b2o100b3o
3b2o28bo3bo$489b2o118bo3bo46b2o$519b2o5b2o131bo2b2o$519b2o5b2o51bo29bo
3bo28b2o14b3o2bo5b2o$564bo13b3o27b3o3b2o26b2o14bo4bo5b2o$563b3o12bob2o
10b2o13b2o6bo42b5o$562b2obo13b3o10b2o12b3o2b2o2bo21b2o20b2o$562b3o14b
2o30b2obo22bobo$563b2o51bo20bo$615b3o4b2o$614bo3bo3b2o$614b2ob2o$614b
2ob2o2$469b2o143b2ob2o$469bo92b3o49b2ob2o$449bo17bobo91bo2bo12b3o34bo
3bo$450bo3bo12b2o95bo12bo2bo34b3o$447bo7bo108bo12bo38bo31b3o$445bo5b2o
2bo105bobo13bo70bo$444bob2o5b2o123bobo68bo$442b3ob2o3b3o$441bo223b2o$
442b3ob2o3b3o210bobo15b2o$444bob2o5b2o24bo184bo17b2o$445bo5b2o2bo23bo
2b2o131bo7bo28b2o10b3o$447bo7bo22bo5bo94bo34b4o3b4o10b2o15bobo$450bo3b
o24bobo2b2o78bo13b3o33bo3bobo3bo10b2o15bob2o$449bo29bo3b2o3bo74b3o11b
2obo34bo2bobo2bo29b2o$481b3o4b3o72bob2o10b3o35b3o3b3o29bo10b3o$491bo
72b3o11b2o84bo17b2o$481b3o4b3o73b2o87bo10bobo15b2o$463b2o14bo3b2o3bo
164b2o10b2o$463bobo3bo9bobo2b2o149b2o15bob2o$469bo8bo5bo150b2o15bobo$
463bo5bo9bo2b2o168b2o$463b2o14bo135b2o5b2o$464b5o146b2o5b2o$465bo2bo
93b3o$465bo2bo93bo2bo11b3o$465b3o94bo13bo2bo$562bo16bo$563bobo13bo$
456b2o3bo114bobo$441b2o13b3obob2o$441b2o13b3o4bo$459bo3bo$460b3o10bo$
472bobo197b2o$460b3o10b2o104bo93bo$459bo3bo100bo13b3o92bobo$441b2o13b
3o4bo99b3o12bob2o92b2o12bo3b3o$441b2o13b3obob2o19b4o42b4o29b2obo13b3o
105bobo2b5o$456b2o3bo4b2o14b6o21b2o17b6o21b2o5b3o14b2o106bo3b2o$482b4o
b2o16b4ob2o16b4ob2o16b4ob2o5b2o123bo2bo3b2obo$486b2o17b6o21b2o17b6o
132b3o3b2ob3o$506b4o37bo4b4o145bo$466b2o79b4o138b3o3b2ob3o$468bobo78b
3o109b2o25bo2bo3b2obo$465bo2b7o68bo8bo106b5o23bo3b2o$465b2ob6obo67b2o
3b4o106bo4bo23bobo2b5o$442b6o5b4o10bo7bo66bobo3b3o7bo99bo2b3o24bo3b3o$
442b4o7b2obo53b2o5b2o30bo8b2o17b3o74bo3b2o2bo$445b2obo7bo53b2o5b2o38bo
bo17bo2bo71b3o5b2o$447b2o5b2o121bo73bo$577bo74b3o5b2o$447b2o5b2o122bob
o73bo3b2o2bo15b2o$445b2obo7bo21b2o178bo2b3o13bobo$442b4o7b2obo20bo60b
2o118bo4bo8b3o2bo$442b6o5b4o19bo2b2o10b2o17b3o3b3o20b2o118b5o15bo$476b
o2bo11b2o16bo2bo3bo2bo18bo122b2o15b2o$476bobo30bo3bobo3bo11b2o142b2o$
477b2o29b2obobobobob2o11b2o45bo94b2obo$508b2ob2o3b2ob2o10bo14b2o16bo
13b3o94b3o$477b2o30b3o5b3o27b2o14b3o11b2obo95bo$476bobo67bo16bob2o10b
3o$476bo2bo11b2o71b3o11b2o105bo$476bo2b2o10b2o71b2o115b2o2bo$465b2o10b
o202bo5bo13b2o$464bobo11b2o47bo151b2o2bobo14b2o$464bo62b2o151b2o3bo$
463b2o61bobo140bo11b3o$520bo147bobo$520b2o146b2o11b3o$519bobo13bo144b
2o3bo$479b2o14b3o37b2o40b3o9b2o44b2o42b2o2bobo14b2o$479b2o12bo3bo36bob
o9b2o28bo2bo7bo4bo40bo4bo36bo4bo5bo13b2o$492bo4bo47b2ob2o6b2o21bo6bo
22b6o17bo22b6o15bo4b2o2bo$492bo3bo49bo2bo6b2o21bo6bo5bo16bo5bo16bo5bo
16bo5bo13bo9bo$546bo2bo26bobo7b6o17bo22b6o17bo$492bo3bo50b2o46bo14bo4b
o40bo4bo$492bo4bo17b2o77bobo15b2o44b2o15b2o$479b2o12bo3bo8b2o8b2o29b2o
42b3o81b2o$479b2o14b3o8b2o7bo30bo2bo40bo80b3o2b2o$535bo10bo2bo6b2o33bo
3bo2b3o66b4o3bobo$534bobo8b2ob2o6b2o34b3o3bo68b2o6bo10b2o2bo4b2o2b2o$
546b2o16bo18b3o13bo24b2o5b2o53bob2o6b2ob2o$563b3o17bo40b2o5b2o39b2o13b
o6bobo$526b2o34b2obo18bo102b3o4b2o$526b2o34b3o$563b2o122b3o4b2o$663bo
23bo6bobo$504bo98b2o58b2o21bob2o6b2ob2o$504b2o97bobo19bo5bo18b2o9bob3o
20b2o2bo4b2o2b2o$503bobo97bo20b3o3b3o17b2o13b2o$610b2o11b2o2bobo2b2o
30b2o$610bobo10bo3bobo3bo30bo$595b2o13bo12bob2o3b2obo$577b3o15bobo25b
2o7b2o30bo$526b3o3b3o42bo2bo14bo68b2o$480b2o43bo2bo3bo2bo41bo72b2o13b
2o$479bo49bobo45bo72b2o9bob3o$466b2o10bo2b2o46bobo46bobo82b2o11b2o$
466b2o10bo2bo18bo28bobo131bo12bobo$478bobo11b2o4bo2bo23bo2bo3bo2bo78b
3o61bo$479b2o12b2o3b5o10b2o11bo7bo79bo63b2o$492bo5b3ob2o9b2o100bo$479b
2o18b2obo118b3o$478bobo19b2o119bo9b2o$466b2o10bo2bo82bo41b3o13bo23b2o
14b2o$466b2o10bo2b2o17b2o61b3o29b2o9bo38b2o15b2o$479bo19b2obo60bob2o
18b2o7bobo10bo38b5o$480b2o16b3ob2o9b2o49b3o18b2o6b2obo13b2o35b4o$498b
5o10b2o49b2o28b2o$498bo2bo93bo51b4o$500bo25b2o5b2o91b2o18b5o$526b2o5b
2o60bo30bobo6b2o8b2o15b2o$594b2o30bo8b2o9b2o14b2o$585b2o6b2obo10bo$
585b2o7bobo9bobo$595b2o9bobo$577b3o$576bo2bo35b2o$579bo35b2o$579bo$
576bobo2$637b3o$637bo$638bo3$564bo$563b3o43bo5bo$562b2obo42b3o3b3o44bo
$562b3o42b2o2bobo2b2o43b2o$563b2o41bob4ob4obo40bob3o11b2o$608b3o3b3o
25b2o19b2o10b2o$607b3o5b3o23bo7b2o11b2o$628b2o10bo2b2o4bobo10bo$628b2o
10bo2bo5bo$640bobo19bo$531b2o5b2o101b2o19b2o$531b2o5b2o123b2o10b2o$
577b3o61b2o16bob3o11b2o$577bo2bo59bobo18b2o$577bo50b2o10bo2bo17bo$577b
o50b2o10bo2b2o$578bobo60bo$608b2o5b2o25b2o$532bo5bo69b2o5b2o$531b3o3b
3o$530bo2b2ob2o2bo$530b3o5b3o2$564bo$563b3o$563bob2o$564b3o$564b2o8$
577b3o$576bo2bo$538bo40bo$539bo39bo$537b3o36bobo5$603b2o5b2o$603b2o5b
2o$528bo7bo27bo$527b4o3b4o25b3o$527bo3bobo3bo24b2obo$528bo2bobo2bo13bo
11b3o$528b3o3b3o11bobo12b2o$549b2o2$603b3o3b3o$602bo2bo3bo2bo$602b2obo
3bob2o2$528b2o5b2o$528b2o5b2o40b3o$577bo2bo$561bo15bo$562bo14bo$560b3o
15bobo3$545b2o$545b2o2$554bo3bo5bob2o$544b2o7bo5bo4bobobo$544b2o7bo9bo
4bo$553b2o3bo5bobobo36bo$555b3o6bob2o35b2o$604b2o$555b3o$553b2o3bo$
544b2o7bo15b2o$544b2o7bo5bo9b2o$554bo3bo2$545b2o$545b2o30b3o25b3o5b3o$
576bo2bo25bo2b2ob2o2bo$579bo12bobo11b3o3b3o$579bo12b2o13bo5bo$576bobo
14bo3$557b2o5b2o$557b2o5b2o2$606b2o5b2o$606b2o5b2o2$582bo$580b2o$581b
2o3$596b2o$596b2o$586bo$576b2o6bo2bo$574bob3o5b5o8b2o$572b3o4bo4b3ob2o
7b2o$574bob3o6b2obo$576b2o8b2o2$586b2o$585b2obo$572b2o10b3ob2o7b2o$
572b2o10b5o8b2o$584bo2bo$586bo$596b2o$596b2o7$577b2o5b2o$577b2o5b2o!



A helix that matches the H climbers would be 18c/99. This means the stationary *WSS guns would be a multiple of 63, much less convenient than 23.

Not sure the 18c/59 helix actually has a use.. (sorry - I did learn a lot about golly scripts and p46 technology though!)
Physics: sophistication from simplicity.
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Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby codeholic » December 31st, 2014, 5:57 am

Okay, I see, you decided to use two LWSS instead of a HWSS for stabilising the helix. In the meanwhile I've found two reactions that make a glider. In fact, the second one makes two. Now I'm looking for a fanout.
x = 40, y = 130, rule = B3/S23
27b3o$27bo2bo$22b2o3bo$21bobo3bo$23bo4bobo6$29bo$14bo13b3o$13b3o11b2ob
o$13bob2o10b3o5b3o$14b3o11b2o4bo2bo$14b2o21bo$33bo3bo$33bo3bo$37bo$34b
obo3$12b3o$5b3o4bo2bo11b3o$5bo2bo3bo13bo2bo$5bo6bo16bo$5bo3bo3bobo13bo
$5bo3bo16bobo$5bo$6bobo4$2bo26bo$b3o10bo13b3o$bob2o8b3o12bob2o$2b3o7b
2obo13b3o3b3o$2b2o8b3o14b2o4bo2bo$13b2o20bo$35bo3bo$35bo3bo$35bo$36bob
o3$12b3o$5b3o3bo2bo12b3o$4bo2bo6bo12bo2bo$7bo6bo12bo$3bo3bo3bobo13bo$
3bo3bo20bobo$7bo$4bobo4$2bo26bo$b3o10bo13b3o$2obo9b3o11b2obo$3o10bob2o
10b3o5b3o$b2o11b3o11b2o4bo2bo$14b2o21bo$33bo3bo$33bo3bo$37bo$34bobo3$
12b3o$5b3o4bo2bo11b3o$5bo2bo3bo13bo2bo$5bo6bo16bo$5bo3bo3bobo13bo$5bo
3bo16bobo$5bo$6bobo4$2bo26bo$b3o10bo13b3o$bob2o8b3o12bob2o$2b3o7b2obo
13b3o3b3o$2b2o8b3o14b2o4bo2bo$13b2o20bo$35bo3bo$35bo3bo$35bo$36bobo3$
12b3o$5b3o3bo2bo12b3o$4bo2bo6bo12bo2bo$7bo6bo12bo$3bo3bo3bobo13bo$3bo
3bo20bobo$7bo$4bobo4$2bo26bo$b3o10bo13b3o$2obo9b3o11b2obo$3o10bob2o10b
3o5b3o$b2o11b3o11b2o4bo2bo$14b2o21bo$33bo3bo$33bo3bo$37bo$34bobo3$12b
3o$5b3o4bo2bo$5bo2bo3bo$5bo6bo$5bo3bo3bobo$5bo3bo$5bo$6bobo4$2bo$b3o$b
ob2o$2b3o$2b2o!

x = 36, y = 126, rule = B3/S23
23b3o$23bo2bo$18b2o3bo$17bobo3bo$19bo4bobo6$25bo$10bo13b3o$9b3o11b2obo
$9bob2o10b3o5b3o$10b3o11b2o4bo2bo$10b2o21bo$29bo3bo$29bo3bo$33bo$30bob
o3$8b3o$2bo5bo2bo11b3o$b3o4bo13bo2bo$2obo4bo16bo$3o6bobo13bo$3o19bobo$
b2o12b3o$14bo2bo$17bo$13bo3bo$17bo$14bobo8bo$10bo13b3o$9b3o12bob2o$8b
2obo13b3o3b3o$8b3o14b2o4bo2bo$9b2o20bo$31bo3bo$31bo3bo$31bo$32bobo3$8b
3o$2bo4bo2bo12b3o$b3o6bo12bo2bo$bob2o5bo12bo$2b3o2bobo13bo$2b3o19bobo$
2b2o11b3o$15bo2bo$15bo$15bo3bo$15bo$16bobo6bo$10bo13b3o$9b3o11b2obo$9b
ob2o10b3o5b3o$10b3o11b2o4bo2bo$10b2o21bo$29bo3bo$29bo3bo$33bo$30bobo3$
8b3o$2bo5bo2bo11b3o$b3o4bo13bo2bo$2obo4bo16bo$3o6bobo13bo$3o19bobo$b2o
12b3o$14bo2bo$17bo$13bo3bo$17bo$14bobo8bo$10bo13b3o$9b3o12bob2o$8b2obo
13b3o3b3o$8b3o14b2o4bo2bo$9b2o20bo$31bo3bo$31bo3bo$31bo$32bobo3$8b3o$
2bo4bo2bo12b3o$b3o6bo12bo2bo$bob2o5bo12bo$2b3o2bobo13bo$2b3o19bobo$2b
2o11b3o$15bo2bo$15bo$15bo3bo$15bo$16bobo6bo$10bo13b3o$9b3o11b2obo$9bob
2o10b3o5b3o$10b3o11b2o4bo2bo$10b2o21bo$29bo3bo$29bo3bo$33bo$30bobo3$8b
3o$2bo5bo2bo$b3o4bo$2obo4bo$3o6bobo$3o$b2o12b3o$14bo2bo$17bo$13bo3bo$
17bo$14bobo!

Or should I have searched only for those that use only LWSS? Is it difficult to produce a middle- or heavyweight spaceship?
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Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby biggiemac » December 31st, 2014, 6:02 am

To make good enough p46 edge-shooters, I had to fall back to your recipes from the waterbear. That left me with no HWSS options. MWSS should be doable, I just never needed to consider it thus far.

Getting far enough to realize I had miscalculated the velocity, I'm not really sure the p118 helix is the best bet. helix.pl turned up many good n=1 results for 18c/99, which would be a correct backrake. However, I don't have the slightest clue whether p63 technology is capable of edge-shooting LWSS..
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Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby codeholic » December 31st, 2014, 6:53 am

biggiemac wrote:However, I don't have the slightest clue whether p63 technology is capable of edge-shooting LWSS..

One can just use the same edge-shooting recipes. Maybe those from the caterpillar would also work.
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Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby codeholic » December 31st, 2014, 8:49 am

A 18c/99 helix:
x = 32, y = 225, rule = B3/S23
24b2o$23bobo$25bo3bo$28b3o$27b2obo$27b3o$28b2o5$26bo$25b3o$25bob2o$26b
3o$18b3o5b2o$18bo2bo$18bo$18bo$19bobo$9b3o$9bo2bo$9bo$9bo$10bobo$17bo$
16b3o$15b2obo$15b3o$8b3o5b2o$7bo2bo$b3o6bo$bo2bo5bo$bo5bobo$bo26b3o$2b
obo22bo2bo$30bo$30bo$27bobo5$25b3o$25bo2bo$25bo$19bo5bo$18b3o5bobo$17b
2obo$17b3o$18b2o$10bo$9b3o$8b2obo$8b3o$9b2o2$16b3o$15bo2bo$18bo$9bo8bo
$8b3o4bobo$2bo5bob2o$b3o5b3o$2obo5b2o$3o26bo$b2o25b3o$28bob2o$29b3o$
29b2o5$26bo$25b3o$24b2obo$24b3o$18b3o4b2o$17bo2bo$20bo$20bo$17bobo$9b
3o$8bo2bo$11bo$11bo$8bobo$17bo$16b3o$16bob2o$17b3o$8b3o6b2o$8bo2bo$b3o
4bo$o2bo4bo$3bo5bobo$3bo24b3o$obo25bo2bo$28bo$28bo$29bobo5$25b3o$24bo
2bo$27bo$19bo7bo$18b3o3bobo$18bob2o$19b3o$19b2o$10bo$9b3o$9bob2o$10b3o
$10b2o2$16b3o$16bo2bo$16bo$9bo6bo$8b3o6bobo$2bo4b2obo$b3o3b3o$bob2o3b
2o$2b3o24bo$2b2o24b3o$27b2obo$27b3o$28b2o5$26bo$25b3o$25bob2o$26b3o$
18b3o5b2o$18bo2bo$18bo$18bo$19bobo$9b3o$9bo2bo$9bo$9bo$10bobo$17bo$16b
3o$15b2obo$15b3o$8b3o5b2o$7bo2bo$b3o6bo$bo2bo5bo$bo5bobo$bo26b3o$2bobo
22bo2bo$30bo$30bo$27bobo5$25b3o$25bo2bo$25bo$19bo5bo$18b3o5bobo$17b2ob
o$17b3o$18b2o$10bo$9b3o$8b2obo$8b3o$9b2o2$16b3o$15bo2bo$18bo$9bo8bo$8b
3o4bobo$2bo5bob2o$b3o5b3o$2obo5b2o$3o26bo$b2o25b3o$28bob2o$29b3o$29b2o
5$26bo$25b3o$24b2obo$24b3o$18b3o4b2o$17bo2bo$20bo$20bo$17bobo$9b3o$8bo
2bo$11bo$11bo$8bobo$17bo$16b3o$16bob2o$17b3o$8b3o6b2o$8bo2bo$b3o4bo$o
2bo4bo$3bo5bobo$3bo$obo!

Unfortunately the trick with a glider and a loaf doesn't work for a fanout device in this case, because the helix moves with a different velocity than the crawler.
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Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby biggiemac » December 31st, 2014, 1:28 pm

Looks good! And at n=1, we don't particularly need fanouts, as each helix supports a H climber as is. The goal of a fanout would be to create a second track from the output of this one, so if it were to be done, the second track would be best if displaced from the first by 58 cells left and 31 cells down. It if ends up being easier to just have 2 helices to make the 2 initial tracks, so be it.
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Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby codeholic » December 31st, 2014, 1:45 pm

Ah, right. That's n=1 already :)
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Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby biggiemac » December 31st, 2014, 1:49 pm

Yup, it's an orthogonal helix that supports the waterbear reaction!
x = 147, y = 236, rule = B3/S23
5$137b2o$136bobo$138bo3bo$115b2o24b3o$116bo23b2obo$116b3o21b3o$111bobo
27b2o$112bo3$114bo$113bo25bo$113b3o22b3o$138bob2o$139b3o$131b3o5b2o$
131bo2bo$131bo$131bo$132bobo$122b3o$122bo2bo$122bo$122bo$123bobo$130bo
$129b3o$128b2obo$128b3o$121b3o5b2o$120bo2bo$114b3o6bo$114bo2bo5bo$114b
o5bobo$114bo26b3o$115bobo22bo2bo$143bo$143bo$140bobo5$138b3o$138bo2bo$
138bo$132bo5bo$131b3o5bobo$130b2obo$130b3o$131b2o$123bo$122b3o$90bo30b
2obo$88b2o31b3o$89b2o31b2o2$129b3o$128bo2bo$131bo$122bo8bo$121b3o4bobo
$115bo5bob2o$114b3o5b3o$113b2obo5b2o$113b3o26bo$114b2o25b3o$141bob2o$
142b3o$142b2o5$139bo$138b3o$137b2obo$137b3o$131b3o4b2o$130bo2bo$133bo$
133bo$130bobo$122b3o$121bo2bo$124bo$124bo$121bobo$130bo$129b3o$129bob
2o$130b3o$121b3o6b2o$121bo2bo$114b3o4bo$113bo2bo4bo$64bo51bo5bobo$64bo
bo49bo24b3o$64b2o47bobo25bo2bo$141bo$141bo$142bobo5$138b3o$137bo2bo$
140bo$132bo7bo$131b3o3bobo$131bob2o$132b3o$132b2o$123bo$122b3o$122bob
2o$123b3o$123b2o2$129b3o$129bo2bo$129bo$122bo6bo$121b3o6bobo$115bo4b2o
bo$114b3o3b3o$114bob2o3b2o$115b3o24bo$115b2o24b3o$140b2obo$140b3o$141b
2o5$139bo$138b3o$39bobo96bob2o$39b2o98b3o$40bo90b3o5b2o$131bo2bo$131bo
$131bo$132bobo$122b3o$122bo2bo$122bo$122bo$123bobo$130bo$129b3o$128b2o
bo$128b3o$121b3o5b2o$120bo2bo$114b3o6bo$114bo2bo5bo$114bo5bobo$114bo
26b3o$115bobo22bo2bo$143bo$143bo$140bobo5$138b3o$138bo2bo$138bo$132bo
5bo$131b3o5bobo$130b2obo$130b3o$131b2o$123bo$122b3o$121b2obo$121b3o$
15bo106b2o$14bo$14b3o112b3o$128bo2bo$131bo$11bo110bo8bo$10b3o108b3o4bo
bo$9b2o2bo101bo5bob2o$13bo100b3o5b3o$12bo100b2obo5b2o$8bo104b3o26bo$8b
obo103b2o25b3o$8b2o131bob2o$142b3o$142b2o5$139bo$138b3o$137b2obo$137b
3o$131b3o4b2o$130bo2bo$133bo$133bo$130bobo$122b3o$121bo2bo$124bo$124bo
$121bobo$130bo$129b3o$129bob2o$130b3o$121b3o6b2o$121bo2bo$114b3o4bo$
113bo2bo4bo$116bo5bobo$116bo$113bobo!



So for producing it, do you think p7 reflector loops are the most compact p63 gun technology? I can't find the fast p7 reflector to judge its size. I'm wary to go to Herschel tracks but I know they tend to be rather easy to synthesize, looking to the end goal of making arbitrary helix for a fixed cost.

Edit: the smart option would be to toggle whether the guns are producing or not, rather than create and destroy them for each waterbear. So it doesn't matter how synthesizable the technology is, just that it works.
Last edited by biggiemac on December 31st, 2014, 4:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby biggiemac » December 31st, 2014, 2:22 pm

biggiemac wrote:As is, I'm now just curious how much can be simply constructed with helices. If we have two helices advancing at different rates, could their outputs collide to create a trail of beehives with separation (23,5)? I feel like that's a generalization of the principle behind the blockstacker. Use helix-like rakes to construct a trail from some still life, repeated with (x,y) displacement.


As long as the object can be made by a 90 degree 2g collision, the strategy seems to be: Find and produce two orthogonal helices, one that advances by y+x and the other by y-x, in some N generations (N can be arbitrary as long as it's the same for both) that both support backrakes. It will temporarily create the pattern desired, but of course the x displacement will give it a finite lifetime.

If we need 180 degree collision, it's the period that needs to differ between the two. The helices need to both advance by either y+x or y-x. One needs to have period N (arbitrary) and the other needs period N + 8x (the time it takes a glider to travel 2x). If the goal is to lay the pattern from bottom up, then the faster helix needs the forward rake.

For coordinated collisions of more than 2 gliders, these principles work but I can't see the overall design working without some awkward packing of guns. Slow salvos would probably be a better bet.

I'm curious the limitations here. Can helices constructible from stationary guns simulate the output of an arbitrary-displacement rake or puffer? Would it in fact be possible to make the true Waterbear helix from stationary guns, by having them produce helices that collide gliders?
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Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby biggiemac » December 31st, 2014, 4:53 pm

It's entirely possible to produce segments of an oblique helix using only stationary components. It's easiest with a 180 collision recipe like for HWSS, shown below. This particular device is useless, but convenient because 46 and 150 differ by a multiple of 8. Also I'm sure that there are better mechanisms to toggle a gun's output at a large period, like synthesizing an eater in front, but this was the first approach I tried.
x = 4101, y = 1021, rule = B3/S23
32bo$31bobo$14b2o14bo3b2o$14bobo13bo3b2o3b2o$5b3ob2o4b3o12bo3b2o3b2o$
5b4o2bo4b3o12bobo$9b2o4b3o7bo6bo$14bobo9b2o$14b2o9b2o17b2o$44bo$42bobo
$42b2o3$37bo$37bo$32bo4bo$33b2o$33b2o$35bo$28b2ob4o$30bo5$21bo$9b2o10b
2o$2b3o4b2o9bobo$b5o6b2o12b2o19bobo$obo3bo5b3o10bo3bo18b2o$2o3bo6b2o
10bo5bo3b2o12bo$9b2o13bo3bob2o2b2o$9b2o13bo5bo$25bo3bo$26b2o11$75b2o
19b2o$76bo19bo$76bobo5bo9bobo$77b2o4bobo8b2o$82bob2o12b2o$81b2ob2o12b
2o$82bob2o$83bobo$84bo7$96b2o3b2o2$97bo3bo$92bo5b3o$93bo4b3o$85bo5b3o
10b2o6b2o$86b2o14bo4bo2bo4bo$85b2o15bo4bo2bo4bo$102bo4bo2bo4bo$104b2o
6b2o3$31b2o$30bo3bo$14b2o13bo5bo$14b2o13bo3bob2o2b2o$5b2o3bo6b2o10bo5b
o3b2o12bo$5bobo3bo5b3o10bo3bo18b2o$6b5o6b2o12b2o19bobo$7b3o4b2o9bobo$
14b2o10b2o$26bo5$35bo$33b2ob4o$40bo$38b2o$38b2o$37bo4bo$42bo$42bo3$47b
2o$47bobo$49bo$19b2o9b2o17b2o$19bobo9b2o$14b2o4b3o7bo6bo89bobo$10b4o2b
o4b3o12bobo89b2o$10b3ob2o4b3o12bo3b2o3b2o76bobo3bo$19bobo13bo3b2o3b2o
77b2o$19b2o14bo3b2o82bo$36bobo$37bo31$165bo$166b2o$160bo4b2o$161b2o$
160b2o34$202bobo$203b2o$197bobo3bo$198b2o$198bo33$240bo$241b2o$235bo4b
2o$236b2o$235b2o34$277bobo$278b2o$272bobo3bo$273b2o$273bo33$315bo$316b
2o$310bo4b2o$311b2o$310b2o34$352bobo$353b2o$347bobo3bo$348b2o$348bo33$
390bo$391b2o$385bo4b2o$386b2o$385b2o34$427bobo$428b2o$422bobo3bo$423b
2o$423bo33$465bo$466b2o$460bo4b2o$461b2o$460b2o34$502bobo$503b2o$497bo
bo3bo$498b2o$498bo33$540bo$541b2o$535bo4b2o$536b2o$535b2o34$577bobo$
578b2o$572bobo3bo$573b2o$573bo33$615bo$616b2o$610bo4b2o$611b2o$610b2o
34$652bobo$653b2o$647bobo3bo$648b2o$648bo33$690bo$691b2o$685bo4b2o$
686b2o$685b2o$691b3o$691bo$692bo9$703b2o$703bobo$703bo10$714b3o$714bo$
715bo9$726b2o$726bobo$726bo10$737b3o$737bo$738bo9$749b2o$749bobo$749bo
10$760b3o$760bo$761bo3315b2o5b2o$4073b2o2b2o5b2o2b2o$4073b2o13b2o7$
772b2o$772bobo3303bo5bo$772bo52b2o3250bobo3bobo$825b2o3249bo3bobo3bo$
4076bo3bobo3bo$4076bo9bo$824b2o6b3o14b2o$824b2o6bo3bo12b2o3226b2o5b2o$
832bo4bo$833bo3bo2$833bo3bo7b3o3231bo3bo$783b3o46bo4bo5b2obob2o3227b2o
$783bo40b2o6bo3bo5bo5b2o3226bo3bobo3b2o$784bo39b2o6b3o8b2obob2o3226bo
3bobo$845b3o3229b3o$889bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo
42bo2bo42bo2bo2434bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo
2bo42bo2bo17bo2bo$825b2o40b4o22bo19b4o22bo19b4o22bo19b4o22bo19b4o22bo
19b4o22bo19b4o22bo19b4o22bo19b4o22bo2411b4o22bo19b4o22bo19b4o22bo19b4o
22bo19b4o22bo19b4o22bo19b4o22bo19b4o22bo19b4o22bo16b2o$825b2o39bo3bo
18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo
18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo2410bo3bo18bo3bo18bo
3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo
3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo$870bo19b4o22bo19b4o22bo19b4o22b
o19b4o22bo19b4o22bo19b4o22bo19b4o22bo19b4o22bo19b4o2414bo19b4o22bo19b
4o22bo19b4o22bo19b4o22bo19b4o22bo19b4o22bo19b4o22bo19b4o22bo19b4o$866b
o2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo2434bo2bo
42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo$816b2o5b2o25b
3o$816b2o5b2o25bo2bo$795b2o53bo$795bobo52bo$795bo55bobo5$4073bobo$
4072bo$4072bo$4072bo2bo$4072b3o$806b3o$806bo$807bo7$850b3o$849bo2bo$
818b2o32bo$818bobo31bo$818bo30bobo5$4071bobo$4074bo$4074bo$4071bo2bo$
4072b3o$829b3o$829bo$830bo7$850b3o$850bo2bo$841b2o7bo$841bobo6bo$841bo
9bobo5$869b2o5b2o3195bobo$869b2o5b2o3194bo$869b2o5b2o3194bo$869b3o3b3o
3194bo2bo$869bobo3bobo3194b3o$852b3o14bo2bobo2bo$852bo18b2ob2o$853bo
118b2o5b2o$972b2o5b2o3$869b2o5b2o$869b2obobob2o$869bo2bobo2bo94b3o3b3o
$850b3o16b3o3b3o94bo2bobo2bo$849bo2bo118bo3bobo3bo$852bo11b2o106bo2bob
o2bo$852bo11bobo107bo3bo$849bobo12bo107b2o5b2o$971b3o5b3o$971b3o5b3o3$
4071bobo$4074bo$4074bo$4071bo2bo$946b3o14b2o3107b3o$946bo3bo12b2o$946b
o4bo$916b2o14b2o13bo3bo$916b2o15b2o$929b5o13bo3bo$929b4o13bo4bo$866b2o
5b2o71bo3bo12b2o$866bob2ob2obo54b4o13b3o14b2o$867bobobobo55b5o37bobo$
850b3o14bobobobo42b2o15b2o36b2o$850bo2bo12bo7bo41b2o14b2o38bo$850bo$
850bo$851bobo94bobo24bo7bo$868b2ob2o76b2o23bobo5bobo$866bo2bobo2bo74bo
27bo3bo$866b3o3b3o99bo2bo3bo2bo$867bo5bo101bobo3bobo$977b2ob2o3091bobo
$866b2o5b2o86bo12b2ob2ob2ob2o3087bo$866b2o5b2o84b2o13b2o2bobo2b2o3087b
o$960b2o13b3o3b3o3088bo2bo$976bo5bo3089b3o2$923bobo2b2o$922bo3bob3o4b
2o20bo11b2o$923bo6b2o3b2o19bo12b2o4b2o5b2o$896bo3b2o22b5obo25b3o16b2o
5b2o$888b2o4b2obob3o25b3o$888b2o4bo4b3o$894bo3bo28b3o$895b3o26b5obo17b
obo$850b3o70bo6b2o3b2o11b2o$849bo2bo42b3o24bo3bob3o4b2o12bo$852bo41bo
3bo24bobo2b2o$852bo35b2o4bo4b3o15bo$849bobo36b2o4b2obob3o16b2o43bo5bo$
896bo3b2o15b2o26bo16b3o3b3o$945bobo13b2o2bobo2b2o$945b2o13bob4ob4obo$
962b3o3b3o$961b3o5b3o3099bobo$938bo3135bo$936b2o3136bo$937b2o3132bo2bo
$4072b3o2$928bobo$867b4o42b4o12b2o3bo$866b6o17b2o21b6o11bo3bo24b2o13b
2o$865b2ob4o16b2ob4o16b2ob4o15b3o22b2o2b2o5b2o2b2o$866b2o21b6o17b2o48b
2o5b2o$890b4o3$850b3o16b2o$850bo2bo14b2o$850bo19bo63b3o15bobo2b2o$850b
o25b2o21b2o5b2o26bo16bo3bob3o4b2o$851bobo21b2o22b2o5b2o27bo16bo6b2o3b
2o$861b2o14bo45bob2o26b5obo$860b2o55b2o3bo2b2o2b3o24b3o$862bo54b2o3bo
6b2o$922b2o3b3o26b3o$924bo3bo24b5obo3113bobo$952bo6b2o3b2o3106bo$881bo
42bo3bo22bo3bob3o4b2o3106bo$880b2o40b2o3b3o22bobo2b2o3113bo2bo$880bobo
34b2o3bo6b2o3141b3o$888bo28b2o3bo2b2o2b3o$887b2o10b3o3b3o15bob2o$873bo
13bobo8bo3bobo3bo$872b2o23bo3b2ob2o3bo$872bobo22bob2o5b2obo$899bo7bo4$
850b3o39b2o$849bo2bo38b2o12bo$852bo40bo5b3obobo$852bo46b3o5b2o15b2o2bo
4b2o2b2o$849bobo22b3o7b2o12bobo7bo15bob2o6b2ob2o$860b2o11bo4bo4bo2bo
11bob4o3b2o16bo6bobo$860b2o10bo5bo4bo2bo13bo5b2o3b2o12b3o4b2o$873bo8bo
3bo12b2o10b2o$874b2o49b3o4b2o$882bob2o39bo6bobo3136bobo$874b2o6bobo25b
2o12bob2o6b2ob2o3135bo$873bo8bobo19bo5b2o12b2o2bo4b2o2b2o3135bo$860b2o
10bo5bo5bo18b2o3166bo2bo$860b2o11bo4bo3b3o18bobo3166b3o$874b3o5b3o$
883b2o$890b2o$886b2o2b2o$886b2o5$850b3o62b2o$850bo2bo60b2o$850bo65bo$
850bo$851bobo2$930b2o2bobo$883b2o5b2o37b3obo3bo12b2o$882bo2bo3bo2bo35b
2o6bo13b2o$883bo2bobo2bo30b2obo3bob5o3137bobo$886bobo14b2o12b3o2b2o2bo
3b3o3139bo$884b3ob3o12b2o13b2o6bo3145bo$882b3o5b3o26b3o3b2o3b3o3139bo
2bo$882b2o7b2o27bo3bo4bob5o3136b3o$882b2o7b2o35b2o6bo13b2o$883bob2ob2o
bo28bo3bo4b3obo3bo12b2o$883b3o3b3o27b3o3b2o3b2o2bobo$884bo5bo12b2o13b
2o6bo$903b2o12b3o2b2o2bo$922b2obo$883b2o5b2o$883b2o5b2o2$850b3o$849bo
2bo$852bo$852bo$849bobo5$4071bobo$4074bo$4074bo$4071bo2bo$4072b3o$881b
o2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo2434bo2bo
42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo$857b4o19bo22b
4o19bo22b4o19bo22b4o19bo22b4o19bo22b4o19bo22b4o19bo22b4o19bo22b4o19bo
2414b4o19bo22b4o19bo22b4o19bo22b4o19bo22b4o19bo22b4o19bo22b4o19bo22b4o
19bo22b4o19bo$857bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3b
o18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3b
o2410bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo
3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo18bo3bo39b2o$839b
2o16bo22b4o19bo22b4o19bo22b4o19bo22b4o19bo22b4o19bo22b4o19bo22b4o19bo
22b4o19bo22b4o2411bo22b4o19bo22b4o19bo22b4o19bo22b4o19bo22b4o19bo22b4o
19bo22b4o19bo22b4o19bo22b4o40b2o$837bo2bo17bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo
42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo2434bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo
2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo42bo2bo$845b3o3229b3o$842bobo3bo3226b2obob2o8b
3o6b2o$837b2o3bobo3bo3226b2o5bo5bo3bo6b2o$846b2o3227b2obob2o5bo4bo$
841bo3bo3231b3o7bo3bo2$4087bo3bo$4087bo4bo$839b2o5b2o3226b2o12bo3bo6b
2o$4074b2o14b3o6b2o$838bo9bo$838bo3bobo3bo$838bo3bobo3bo3249b2o$839bob
o3bobo3250b2o$840bo5bo8$835b2o13b2o$835b2o2b2o5b2o2b2o$839b2o5b2o!


For the waterbear helix, we would need 180 degree LWSS and MWSS recipes and glider guns with periods differing by 80. I'll edit later when I figure out the actual numbers.

To synthesize the waterbear helix from SW and NE gliders, we would need p86 and p166 guns. From SE and NW, p46 and p126. I don't know what recipes exist with only 180 degree collisions for LWSS and MWSS though. Is there a transparent reaction that downgrades a HWSS?
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Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby gameoflifemaniac » January 24th, 2017, 11:21 am

Is it possible to make a Waterbear puffer or rake (or gun)?
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Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby BlinkerSpawn » January 24th, 2017, 2:05 pm

gameoflifemaniac wrote:Is it possible to make a Waterbear puffer or rake (or gun)?

Yes, the Waterbear can definitely be synthesized with gliders so it can be constructed by a gun.
However, said gun would be (at least) millions of cells at a side and have a ridiculously high period which would in turn make constructing even the constituent guns very difficult.
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Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby dvgrn » January 24th, 2017, 2:41 pm

BlinkerSpawn wrote:
gameoflifemaniac wrote:Is it possible to make a Waterbear puffer or rake (or gun)?

Yes, the Waterbear can definitely be synthesized with gliders so it can be constructed by a gun.
However, said gun would be (at least) millions of cells at a side and have a ridiculously high period which would in turn make constructing even the constituent guns very difficult.

The rake and puffer cases are a lot easier. For example, you can make a three-stream backrake just by removing the two Herschels near (6000,25400) in the copy of the waterbear in the Very Large Patterns archive -- and maybe doing a little cleanup.

There are ways to add attachments, there or elsewhere, to leave just a single-stream forerake or backrake, or a single-object puffer or sideways *WSS rake or whatever you want along those lines.

(No, I don't really know the details of how to do any of these -- could figure it out eventually by studying the mechanisms in the rest of the waterbear for long enough... but by default all I can do is break things in the back corners of the spaceship and see what happens.)

I'm a little nervous about saying that the waterbear can "definitely" be synthesized by gliders, since no one has actually done it yet... but really I agree that it can clearly be done somehow. There may be a lot of difficult special cases to solve, though, to get the whole thing up and running successfully.

Once a glider recipe exists, building the required high-period glider guns wouldn't be a big deal (relatively speaking). We're actually within easy reach of writing a script that can take as input any glider construction recipe of any size, and build a shotgun for it. Nobody has put all the pieces together yet, but you might say it's in the works...!

What I'd really like to see is a freeze-dried waterbear -- i.e., a constellation of small still lifes that (eventually) turns into a waterbear when you hit it with a glider. That's another script that could actually be written. As long as efficiency doesn't matter too much, an automatic compiler could be written that produces a stable "seed" constellation for any object that has a glider synthesis.
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Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby gameoflifemaniac » January 25th, 2017, 9:06 am

dvgrn wrote:
BlinkerSpawn wrote:
gameoflifemaniac wrote:Is it possible to make a Waterbear puffer or rake (or gun)?

Yes, the Waterbear can definitely be synthesized with gliders so it can be constructed by a gun.
However, said gun would be (at least) millions of cells at a side and have a ridiculously high period which would in turn make constructing even the constituent guns very difficult.

The rake and puffer cases are a lot easier. For example, you can make a three-stream backrake just by removing the two Herschels near (6000,25400) in the copy of the waterbear in the Very Large Patterns archive -- and maybe doing a little cleanup.

There are ways to add attachments, there or elsewhere, to leave just a single-stream forerake or backrake, or a single-object puffer or sideways *WSS rake or whatever you want along those lines.

(No, I don't really know the details of how to do any of these -- could figure it out eventually by studying the mechanisms in the rest of the waterbear for long enough... but by default all I can do is break things in the back corners of the spaceship and see what happens.)

I'm a little nervous about saying that the waterbear can "definitely" be synthesized by gliders, since no one has actually done it yet... but really I agree that it can clearly be done somehow. There may be a lot of difficult special cases to solve, though, to get the whole thing up and running successfully.

Once a glider recipe exists, building the required high-period glider guns wouldn't be a big deal (relatively speaking). We're actually within easy reach of writing a script that can take as input any glider construction recipe of any size, and build a shotgun for it. Nobody has put all the pieces together yet, but you might say it's in the works...!

What I'd really like to see is a freeze-dried waterbear -- i.e., a constellation of small still lifes that (eventually) turns into a waterbear when you hit it with a glider. That's another script that could actually be written. As long as efficiency doesn't matter too much, an automatic compiler could be written that produces a stable "seed" constellation for any object that has a glider synthesis.

I've done a five-stream Waterbear rake by removing three Herschels!
EDIT I made a Waterbear dirty puffer by removing only one Herschel. Just remove the Herschel near (6651, 26413).
EDIT2 You can remove the bottom-most oblique glider row, too (otherwise it will be removed by itself, but the puffer will not be destroyed).
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Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby gameoflifemaniac » January 25th, 2017, 9:21 am

Thanks for the hint! I always dreamed of a Waterbear puffer or rake.
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Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby gameoflifemaniac » January 25th, 2017, 9:22 am

Now for the gun...
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Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby biggiemac » January 25th, 2017, 2:20 pm

The original post in this thread mentioned that the Waterbear construction allowed for (23,5)c/79 versatile rakes and puffers. I never posted any explicit examples but while trying to finish piecing together the whole spaceship I made a whole bunch. None of them seemed indiviaually interesting since they were just the ship itself without cleanup at the back, which is a trivial modification.

Making a gun which fires Waterbears is much less trivial, for reasons mentioned in dvgrn's post as well as higher up on this page. I attempted to demonstrate synthesizing an arbitrarily long stream of Waterbear track gliders using a fixed number of recipe gliders, but kind of gave up once I realized it would require p63 guns. I think a frozen Waterbear would be a much more difficult but much more satisfying thing to construct, and since the Waterbear itself relies on "frozen tracks" in a lot of places the hard part would just be synchronizing the many herschels which do the rest of the construction themselves.

I think a frozen Waterbear would have a number of beehive pairs upwards and to the right equal to the longest signal round trip in the ship, which would probably be track -> NE reset rake -> track - NE reset rake -> track -> NE synthesis rake -> rightmost helix ship. As a order of magnitude estimate that'd be around 4000 beehive pairs required to sustain the front before the helix fully caught up. The rest is just blocking outputs until they are synchronized, which would take another ~10000-100000 still lives or some clever trickery, and starting the herschels. I might try to make a frozen Waterbear activated by some couple hundred gliders and leave it to a script to turn the activation into a single glider.
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Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby dvgrn » January 25th, 2017, 3:17 pm

biggiemac wrote:As a order of magnitude estimate that'd be around 4000 beehive pairs required to sustain the front before the helix fully caught up. The rest is just blocking outputs until they are synchronized, which would take another ~10000-100000 still lives or some clever trickery, and starting the herschels.

That "just" is a good word, but I think it hides quite a bit of work, keeping paths open for a couple hundred gliders to sneak in and hit their targets at the right times.

The suppression side doesn't seem so awful, just a lot of blocks probably. Somewhat fewer if single objects can be set up to absorb multiple outputs, like a block being pulled by two NE-traveling gliders and then deleted by an LWSS. (I assume I'm not saying anything new or interesting here, since a lot of the waterbear's period-doubling mechanisms work something like this...)

I'm not clear yet on whether the suppressing objects for one set of Herschels will tend to get in the way of gliders starting up other Herschels, or if that's easy to avoid somehow.

biggiemac wrote:I attempted to demonstrate synthesizing an arbitrarily long stream of Waterbear track gliders using a fixed number of recipe gliders, but kind of gave up once I realized it would require p63 guns.

Hm, maybe I should try to look at that. Could maybe put together a Spartan++ pseudo-p63 gun made out of two p126 loops, that wouldn't be _too_ expensive to glider-construct and then shoot down again at the right moment.

Constructing and destroying slide guns of just the right period might also be helpful theoretically ...? I'm inclined to agree that the "right" way to tackle this project is the simple way. No need to bother optimizing it using clever temporary constructions -- better to just build a stable seed containing a ridiculous number of still lifes.

biggiemac wrote:I might try to make a frozen Waterbear activated by some couple hundred gliders and leave it to a script to turn the activation into a single glider.

I'd certainly love to see a glider do its work on a one-glider waterbear seed. With a seed constellation available, a very very slow UC-based waterbear gun wouldn't be too far behind. It would be particularly entertaining if the seed could be made significantly smaller than the reconstituted waterbear -- except for the 4000-beehive-pair chain, I suppose.

I guess I can volunteer to write any necessary scripts to get from the trigger-with-N-gliders stage to the trigger-with-1-glider stage. A script-designed solution isn't going to be too pretty if the N gliders are coming from three or four different directions, though.

It would be fine if the initial constellation needed a lot more gliders to get started -- e.g., if we used glider pairs instead of beehive pairs to support the partially defrosted structure, or even did the output-blocking by shooting down individual outputs with gliders. As long as the gliders can all come from infinity, a script can handle the rest.
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Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby biggiemac » January 25th, 2017, 5:45 pm

It'll be tricky to freeze some runs of tightly-packed herschels like the following:
x = 151, y = 231, rule = B3/S23
149bo$148bo$127bo20b3o$126bo$126b3o39$125bo$123b2o$103bo20b2o$101b2o$
102b2o39$99bo$99bobo$77bo21b2o$77bobo$77b2o24$59b3o$59bo2bo$58bo3bo$
58b4o$59bo5$59b2ob2o$59bob3o4$62bo$63bo9b2obo$61b3o7bo4bo$50b3o17bo5bo
$49bo2bo17bo$49b2obo16b2ob2obo$53b2o14b2obo2bo$53b2o16b4o$52bo2bo16b3o
$51bo$51b3o15bo$52bo14b2o$68b2o5$62b2o$62b2o$41b2o21bo$41bobo18b3o$43b
2o16bobo$41bobo18b2o$41bo19bo$41bo2bo16bo$59bo$43b2o4$50bo$31b2o16b3o$
33bo15b4o$34bo$31bobo$32bo16b4o$34bobo12b4o$34bobo14bo$35bo3$26bobo$
26b2o$27bo2$22b3o$21bo2bo15b3o$21b2o2bo13bo3bo$24b2o$44bo$21bo17b5o$
19b2o19bo$20b2o2$40b2o$40b2o$40bo$39b2o$10bobo24b2obob3o$8bo4bo29b2o$
8bo4bo23bo2bo$12b2o24b3o$32bo$8b2o2b2o17b3o$8b2o2b2o16bo2b2o$9bob3o16b
o3bo$12bo19bobo$11bo$29b2ob2o$31bo4$3o28b4o$3o28bobobo$o2bo30bo$b3o$b
2o2$23bo11bo$22b3o10bo$21b2o2bo8bo$21bo$21b3o$21b2obo$22bob2o$22b2o$
23bob2o$22b2ob2o$22b2ob2o$24bo$18bobo$19b2o$19bo3$14bo$13b3o$13bob2o$
14bo2bo$7bo7b2o$8b2o5bo$7b2o!


The closest I can pack two herschels with my naive seed attempt is the following:
x = 78, y = 113, rule = B3/S23
76bo$75bobo$75bobo$76bo20$71bo$70bobo$70bobo$71bo20$66bo$65bobo$65bobo
$66bo11$39b2o$39b2o$52b2o$52b2o2$49bo$48bobo$48b2o12bo$61bobo$61b2o12$
45b2o$46b2o$45bo27$b2o$obo$2bo!


The FNG isn't released until the herschel has covered a lot of ground, so the activated herschel sweeps out a pretty significant area where no seeds could be placed, including the spot right behind it where the next signal in the track goes. This is the case even if I don't steal the first FNG for cleaning the B's block.

I haven't checked different activation directions.
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Re: (23,5)c/79 knightship caterpillar complete!

Postby dvgrn » January 25th, 2017, 6:13 pm

biggiemac wrote:It'll be tricky to freeze some runs of tightly-packed herschels like the following...

Huh, yeah, that's going to be interesting. Might want to build the Herschels without starting with a B-heptomino, to avoid having such a big area swept out, and also to keep from having to clean up the B's extra block.

Other candidates might include the common Herschel descendant at H + 22 ticks, or maybe the pi+block stage that occurs at H + 39, after the glider hits it:

x = 9, y = 8, rule = B3/S23
4bo$2o2bobo$2o2b2o4$7b2o$7b2o!

biggiemac wrote:I haven't checked different activation directions.

The above sample has the glider coming from the direction of the beehive pairs, which is no good of course -- but it seems like even if we add an eater or boat or whatever as a turner, to bring a trigger glider in from the side, that constellation will still fit in a fairly small space. Further bulletins as events warrant...

FURTHER BULLETIN: That basic reaction can certainly add Herschels to the front of a group, fairly close together. But is it going to be important to construct the frontmost Herschels first, and incrementally add to the back of groups? I haven't really tried to trace out where the worst output suppression problems are going to be, and which build order makes them worse.

Anyway -- this works, for what it's worth:

x = 219, y = 330, rule = B3/S23
216bo$216bobo$194bo21b2o$194bobo$194b2o39$191bobo$191b2o$169bobo20bo$
169b2o$170bo38$167bo$166bo$145bo20b3o$144bo$144b3o39$143bo$141b2o$121b
o20b2o$119b2o$120b2o39$117bo$117bobo$117b2o5$62bo$63bo$61b3o8$81bo$79b
3o$78bo$78b2o3$69b2o$69b2o4$76b2o$76b2o2$68bo$67bobo$67bobo$68bo11$87b
2o$87bo$85bobo$85b2o4$85b2o$77b2o5b2o$63bo13b2o7bo$62bobo$62bobo$63bo$
84b2o$84b2o$59b3o$59bo2bo13bo$59bo2bo12bobo9b2o$58b4o13bobo9b2o$58b2o
16bo$57bo$58bo$58bo5$46bobo$46bo2bo$45bo3b2o$45bo2$45bo2b3o18bo$45b2o
21b3o$47b3o17b2o2bo$47b3o17bo3bo$67bob2o$67b2o5$68b2o2bo$37b3o28bobobo
$38bo32bo$38b3o2$71bo$67bo2bobo$60bo11bo$59b3o4b2o2b2o$58bo2b2o$58b4o$
36bobo22bobo$36bobo22bo2bo$61b3o$39bo20bobo$60bobo$29bo30b3o$28b3o24bo
$28bob2o3bobo18b2o$27b2o7bo18b2o$27b2o$27b2o$31bo$30b2o$28bobo19b2o$
27bo2bo19bob2o$28bobo21b2o$28b3o12bobo6b2o$28b2obo12b2o3b2o$28bo2bo12b
o$29bo22b2o3$20bo$19b3o$18b2o2bo$32bo8bo$33b2o6b2o$32b2o7b3o$18b2o21b
2o$19b3o19b2o$22bo19bo$20b3o20bobo$20b2o22bo3$20bobo12bo$21b2o12bobo$
21bo13b2o$32bo$11bo19b3o$10b3o17bo2b2o$9bo2b2o16b3obo$13bo19b2o$13b2o$
15bo13bo$12b4o12bo$12b2o14b3o7$18bo2b2o$22b2o$21b2o$o$obo14b2o2b2o$2o
21bo$17b4o$19bo2bo!

There are probably lots of smaller three-object constellations that can do something similar -- or even two-object climber seeds, most likely. Seems like it's going to be much more expensive to build a triggerable seed that can catch up to a group of climbers from behind, with the seed still lifes all starting safely off to the side. EDIT: Blockic 4-object constellation, a little more compact than the eater turner:

x = 52, y = 15, rule = B3/S23
46bo$9b2o36bo$9b2o34b3o$50b2o$50b2o$4b2o4b3o$4b2o4bo$11bo$2o38b2o4b2o$
2o38b2o4b2o4$7b2o38b2o$7b2o38b2o!
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